§ 01 · The Hook
The bait, then the rug-pull.
Ben opens mid-sentence, already in the compliment — a testimonial cold-open that sounds like the end of a conversation rather than the beginning of a pitch.
Who's talking.
00:00hostRitesh Verma
00:27guestBen
Where the time goes.
00:00 – 01:31
01 · Cold open and testimonial hook
Ben mid-sentence endorsing Ritesh and naming Alex Hormozi as the only other creator he follows. Immediate credibility framing before the formal intro.
01:31 – 04:01
02 · Revenue before vs. after AgentRise
Ben walked through going from GBP 4k/mo declining, joining AgentRise, then climbing to GBP 7-8k (over $10k USD). Top 3 program benefits: owner shows up, great community, availability.
04:01 – 05:47
03 · How Ben entered the gaming niche
Five years in PC checking as a hobbyist before building. Identified existing tools, decided he could build better ones with his deep niche knowledge.
05:47 – 08:39
04 · Law of large numbers and platform strategy
Core growth principle: consistent volume always compounds. Gaming niche is primarily YouTube and Twitch; TikTok streams have better discoverability. Plans to hire a human clipper.
08:39 – 10:34
05 · AI clipping debate and work schedule
AI clipping tools (OpusClip etc.) worked briefly then degraded. Recommends human clippers past a revenue threshold. No formal work schedule — finish the day task list whenever done.
10:34 – 12:01
06 · Best advice: monetize your hobby
The Simon Squibb principle: the only businesses that survive the first dry months are ones you would do anyway as a hobby. Business ideas without passion collapse fast.
12:01 – 15:11
07 · Established vs. emerging market debate
Recommends established markets for ease of entry (no single dominant provider). Cites Reddit SaaS as a current emerging opportunity right before it explodes.
15:11 – 17:35
08 · Is the SaaS space oversaturated?
No. The problem is undifferentiated products, no marketing system, and founders quitting before 3-4 months. Good products with consistent effort still win.
17:35 – 20:05
09 · Goals: $100k/mo and content-as-marketing pivot
Focus on improving service quality and publishing free content (tools, YouTube videos) to build niche authority and make the anti-cheat market mainstream.
20:05 – 22:24
10 · Personal brand strategy
Tried building in public; time constraints led to converting the business channel into a personal channel with niche-adjacent content instead.
22:24 – 25:59
11 · Acquisition math and the $10M target
3-5x ARR formula explained. Ben refuses to sell under $10M (~$300k/mo). Would only consider a sale if the buyer reemployed him. Closing endorsements and wrap.
Lines you could clip.
12:00
"You will never work harder on a business that you enjoy if it is not something you also enjoy in your personal life."
12:15
"Find a hobby, liquidize it into a business."
23:50
"I am a bit delusional. I believe nobody else can do it better than me."
16:35
"It is not necessarily oversaturated. Anything that is very good, if you put time and effort into it, will do well."
08:55
"You can always make another business. Money is a lot of things, but it is not worth losing something important over."
Things they pointed at.
11:07channelSimon Squibb
08:00channelAlex Hormozi
Word for word.
HOOK opening / re-engagementCTA the pitch
00:00HOOKI watch now is just you, Alex or Mozy. Nobody really else definitely got the most source. I own a SaaS online software company.
00:08HOOKI went up. I peaked at, 6 k. Obviously, I want to drive and make as much money as possible.
00:14HOOKPeople from major rides will hit me up, and then I found this passion and I joined. And then now we're up like hitting 10 k USD, which was the goal. Took off from there.
00:22HOOKI used a lot of the skills that I'd learned in just general day to day life. Instead of making it promotional, kind of making it personal what I use in my business.
00:30Hey, what's up, Ben? Tell you more about yourself and what's your current business. Alright.
00:34And just more about your journey. Hi. What's up everybody?
00:36So my name is Ben. Obviously, I own own a SaaS online software company and basically, we deal with catching cheaters in online video games, which is quite a niche market, but it's great fun. It's one of my hobbies and I decided to turn into a business.
00:50A bit about where I came from, so I used to work in a lot of fast food. I used to work in a lot of hospitality, just kind of bouncing in between jobs. And then I found this passion and then basically it took off from there.
01:00I used a lot of the skills that I'd learned in just general day to day life, just having, you know, good parents, good friends around me, then ended up wanting to join. A community where there are like minded people like myself, in the online SaaS business, mainly just to get somebody who's the the next step up for me or few steps up for me to kinda get their take on my business as that's something that's really helpful that you guys should do.
01:21And, yeah, you know, I found Ritesh on YouTube, seem a really nice genuine guy and, know, every single session I have with him has been great and he's been helping me scale my company upwards basically. And that's it really, I I just gotta say. Yeah.
01:32Solid. Solid. So let me ask you this.
01:33Before you joined, uh, AgentRise, right, what were your revenue numbers per month? And then after you joined, you know, where what was the where do they hit?
01:41Where do they how much do they go to? So basically, I went up, I peaked to like six k, then I started dropping down to like four k and I joined.
01:50And then now we're up like hitting sevens and eights. This is pounds, so it's already over you at 10 k USD, which is the goal. And I'll basically ever since I've had a chat with Ritesh, like, when we were going down, I like a couple weeks, I like had recurring meetings and now it's kind of just gone up.
02:04And then we got past 10 k really and it was you know, 10 k USD about seven to eight k pounds. And now I've had another chat with him about a month or two ago, and we spoke about stuff to get a 100 k a month now. Now I'm just kinda grinding through that.
02:16If I need any issues, then I go to him. But so far, it's going all well at the moment. I'm gonna go, like, it's good.
02:21Alright. Lit. Lit.
02:22Yeah. No. Feel free to schedule more.
02:24You know, you don't have to wait till you hit 20 k a month, 30 k a month. You know, it's his end schedule. You can always be in the middle I mean, in the in between.
02:30What are the top three ways the AG Rides program has helped you? Okay. Number one, unlike every other course in my opinion, like Ritesh, the owner actually will come and speak to you and help you out, which sounds like something silly, but you'll be surprised the amount of people that I've heard have had a course and the guy who runs it doesn't even show up or, like, get someone else to do it and it's like, we're paying for your experience and your thing.
02:51Two, I'd say it's nice. Like, I have the occasional person. Like, I'd say because of how niche my community is, I don't tend to need to network to people within Age and Rise.
03:01But people from Age and Rise will hit me up and, like, come say hello, and I'll, like, say hi back. I'll chat to them. It's nice to kind of mix minds with somebody already in, like, the same mindset as me, like, just wanting to grow a business and, you know, make something great.
03:13So it's great, like, you meet new friends, new networking, like, people will be hitting you up as whether you as well as you being able to hit them up, everyone's friendly. Like, everyone's gonna chat to you, which is also great. So Ritesh showing up, great friends.
03:23I'd also see, like, availability as well. Not only does he show up, he's also available as well, which is great.
03:29I know I haven't been available over the past few times. Ritesh has asked to meet with me. And also, it was partly because I accidentally turned off WhatsApp notifications.
03:36But how you go? But, yeah, he's also very available. Like, you can go in his calendar, you can book a meeting with him, like, he will show up on time.
03:43He'll be available and he'll be there for you, like, he'll be doing nothing else. Like, that's the main three things. Availability,
03:48he will actually show up for you, and it is a great community, like, truly great community. Actually talk and bond together and there's like a lot of good systems set up to the point where everybody can bounce ideas off each other, I'd say. Yeah.
03:59And I appreciate that, man. I definitely unclip that. That was fine.
04:02Take it. Take it. I'm good.
04:04How did you get into like the gaming niche? Like, how'd you think of this idea? So basically, I had it as a hobby to start off with anyway.
04:10So I was already doing it, like what's called PC checking in the gaming scene to start with. And then basically, there were these tools that are roundabout that kinda helped out with PC checking, like automating it all through like an app.
04:22And then basically, I seen these tools and I thought, you know, I could do it better. So then I then went ahead and seen what they were doing, understood what I could do better. I had like I I would I had a very advantageous starting point.
04:32I had about five or six years already in the scene about four or five years at the time already in the scene. So I already knew quite a lot. So I then kinda just thought, you know, I guarantee you I can, you know, take over this market, do better than them, then, you know, here I am doing, you know, I'd say I'm quite well.
04:46Yeah. I'm the same dude. Yeah.
04:47You did that shit. Now. Yeah.
04:50That's lit, man. That's lit. Yeah.
04:51So let me ask you this. What what are your your top growth strategies for for some 100 percent.
04:57I think it was Alex Wamuzi who told me, which is the law of large numbers is that. He says, like, yeah. So it's like, the more you put in something, the more you get out of it.
05:04Like, no matter what, like, you'll get more out of something. Even if it's something that is there's not very say, for example, you go into something that doesn't grow a lot, it's gonna grow more the more you put into it even if it's not a lot. That sounds confusing, but, like, dunno.
05:16I See, for example, you got a YouTube channel that involves, I dunno, cutting fruit in certain ways. I'd say from my limited knowledge, that's not a very well researched or people who a lot of people care about that market.
05:28But if you put loads and loads of effort into it, you'll grow it more, you know, to like 10 k subs. If you do like a gaming channel, then you become like a competitive gamer in like a popular game. That will grow a lot more the more you put into it.
05:39You know, you might get like a million subscribers type of thing. So I'd say definitely number one is large numbers. The more you put in something, the more you get out like
05:47spam things with good good quality content, I'd say, not rubbish content and yeah, just just like keep going and it's more important turning up every day than doing a lot over an extended period of time. Yeah.
05:59Literally. Yeah. No.
06:00That's fire that's fire advice. That wasn't really shitty five, it was like a bunch of Yeah. Things in one really.
06:04If you if you had so I don't know, YouTube is one of your main growth engines. Right? Is there any other big growth engine that you're any other platform or social media that you've been using to grow your product?
06:14So the gaming industry is primarily on YouTube, I like to say, and on live streaming providers. So that's what I'm doing. So, like, I'm streaming on YouTube, and that's why I'm always streaming on Twitch and, obviously, TikTok streams as well because the scalability and visibility of streams on TikTok is much better than YouTube and Twitch.
06:30But I'm also trying to make TikTok videos on it too. But because the gaming scene is so primarily on YouTube, I'd say, for watching gaming videos and things like that, which is kind of like we're in like a sub niche of it, like anti sheets for games. I'd say if I was gonna go to another platform, we would be trying to, you know, establish a whole new market in another app, which would be more difficult for me to do.
06:50So I'm just focusing on what's working well at the moment. Yeah. No.
06:53And that's trade sauce. Right? It's on the gamers to, like, hop, like, utilize platform.
06:57You know, if everyone's watching this with, a gaming sack, you know, you know the blueprint. No. I feel like one of the 10 x moves you could probably do is, like, clipping.
07:04Clip, like, gamer gamers and clipping with NVIDIA games and, like, mean, if you're catching cheaters, like, clipping that, you know, will be like, that shouldn't go viral. Right? Yeah.
07:11I'm actually I'm about a higher clipper because I tried using, like, AI clipping softwares and stuff like that to make it easier and, like, a bunch of these things have, like, clippers involved. But like the thing is like nobody's gonna be able to do as well as a human. Like if you're making it if you're running a business, it's like earning more than like and even like 3 k a month.
07:28Like you can put like $500 or pound aside to like asset clipper to like review over like a couple streams and make a few clips, they might be able to make even a couple is gonna be better than these AI services from what I've seen. I'd say they they dwindle out very quickly and, people pick up the Your Content's away.
07:44I generated and it kinda diminishes your brand a little bit. Same thing with the algorithm and things like that.
07:49Like when I first started using like AI clipping softwares, it worked for a little bit and then it just kinda just steadily went downhill, downhill, downhill, downhill. So I think also these media providers like YouTube and things like that also catch on to when you do this.
08:01So I definitely say clipping is good and I am about to hire a clipper, but like a little tip, don't use these AI clipping software. They're not the best.
08:09Like OpusClip for example. Right? Yeah.
08:11Yeah. That's a bit I like use it for like shortening stuff, summarizing stuff, like uses an AI video editor. I wouldn't like plug whole streams into it and just take clips out of it and post them.
08:22I just pay a clipper to do it yourself. Yeah. You might have to pay a bit more, but it's gonna be much better quality.
08:26Yeah. What what would you say right now, like, when working on your SaaS? I think a lot of people neglect neglect the the time the scheduling around it, right, in terms of, like, the work schedule.
08:34Like, what would you say is your work schedule for your SaaS? Oh, no. It's bad.
08:38It's bad. It's basically wake up, get all the work, then you gotta do for the day, and then go to bed when it's done. I know it sounds like so it sounds like very haphazard, not very knowledgeable.
08:48I mean, like, obviously, the family and, you know, I got girlfriend, put her before everything else, of course, because that's you know, that's your future. You can always make another business, things like that. You know, money's a lot of things, but it's not worth losing some important over.
09:01But, yeah, it's like, well, I've been out today, out with some friends, come back late, you know, it's it's 11PM. Gotta do this for Ritesh and, you know, then I gotta do some other stuff and then, you know, I won't be going to bed until it's done. That's the schedule.
09:16It's not like when these influences and people like that say it's on another level, like, it is on another level. And even I feel like sometimes I'm not doing enough, and it's like that's the scariest part is putting the work in, putting the hours in. But I'll be real, like, there is no schedule.
09:30It's like whenever you got spare minute, whenever you got spare time or how I do it is like literally, like, you've got to get a certain amount of things done for the day. Have a notes app, have reminders, you know, and just make sure you have everything mapped out for what you wanna do in the day, and that's the that's the only schedule I have.
09:44I just want it needs to get done in the day. Do you use any AI systems to, like, help you with your scheduling or getting work done? Oh, right.
09:50I'd say when you're starting out, yes, because it would be able to help you prioritize things, do long term projects, things like that. I'm lucky enough to the point where I can either give jobs to different people, then I forget about it, or I literally have it on like a notes app and it'll be like every single day doing that and then longer term projects that just have like in a different section.
10:06Then I make sure I do a little bit on a longer term project every day, and that's basically the whole structure of my day. Like little jobs throughout the whole day, giving little jobs to other people, and then doing a little bit every day on longer projects. So I don't need something to do like an AI system, but I feel like if you're just starting out, having to structure your day, if you have other commitments, things like that, like, I'm lucky that I don't have a day job, so that's that's better for me.
10:26If have a day job, things like that, yeah, I'd say, like, some type of scheduling system would probably help. It's just not I'm not in the right market for it. I'm not the the ideal An ICP.
10:35Yeah. Moving back to the I should probably wrap this up soon, but I'll ask, like, three more questions. That's alright.
10:42Honestly, it's alright. I'm not gonna be going to bed tonight. Already knew I wasn't when I came home at eleven.
10:47I paused to be home, like, thirty minutes before this meeting. I came in Yeah. Just for for me, but it's alright.
10:52But what would you say what is your biggest piece of advice you would give to someone who's just starting out in the SaaS space? Like, they wanna start an online business that's a SaaS. It's one of most popular models right now.
11:01Right? A lot of people, you know, they'll start it and it'll burn. Like, they don't really get anywhere.
11:06So what would you say is like your biggest piece of advice for them? Okay. So first of all, I'm a say I was in your position two years ago.
11:12I know these other influencers, whatever I say they're in your position, they were. Like, I genuinely was. And the thing is,
11:18you can make a lot of money very quickly depending on how much effort you put in and, you know, what niche you're in. But the one thing that I'll say is this chap called Simon Squibb. He's a guy on, like, says on YouTube, whatever.
11:27Like, I watched one of his videos, that's what made me start my company. So I was doing marketing agencies, drop shipping, Amazon FBA, like all of this stuff that was like popping off in like 2024, like 2023,
11:382024, stuff like that. Like I've joined Andrew Tate's course, like I went through that.
11:43That was that was alright actually even though I thought it was gonna be not too great. It was actually pretty good. And basically, I've tried everything like trading, all of it.
11:49And the one thing that I'll say is is you never work harder on a job or a business that you enjoy if it's not something that you also enjoy in your personal life. So what I was told to do was is was to find a hobby if you haven't got one in the moment or take your hobby that you have at the moment and then liquidize that and turn it into a business.
12:08I know Andrew Tate also said that as well. I've seen clips of him saying that too. Andrew Tate is a very controversial character.
12:13Don't know if I could say that on YouTube. I'm not gonna lie, but he said It was very, very true. Literally, you'll never work harder on a business.
12:20And the problem in today's day and age, which I think why people don't actually make money online, is because they don't have any real passion and drive towards the business, except from just making money. But when you don't see money in the first few months, which you won't, you know, we didn't we didn't see money for the first, like, four or five months.
12:37And obviously, it could be shorter or longer. Like, you lose all your passion and drive. Like, in my marketing agency, I didn't.
12:42Trading, I didn't. Things like that and I just lost the drive. But if you actually have it as, like, something you do in your day to day life anyway, then you kind of see it as your own little projects, then just doing it online as a SaaS is the best way to do it nowadays.
12:53It's the easiest way to sell to people. That's why I would say if you have a hobby, liquidize it into a business and sell that business online. Make sure it's something you can sell online.
13:02Yeah. No valid. By the way, how old are you again?
13:05I'm 20. I'm 20 as well. 20.
13:0720. Crazy, man. Crazy, crazy young girl.
13:09If you had to go back in time, which which route would you go? So what I'm gonna say first is everybody knows that there's an issue with cheating in video games. The problem they have is is the second one that you said, which was they know the problem, but it the solution to it is very unknown.
13:23So obviously, people know anti cheats and things like that, but we have an anti cheat bit is different in a way and people don't know that extra layer of anti cheat that they can bring in using our software. So Sorry. Repeat the question one more time real quick.
13:36No. No. Cosmetics.
13:39I would say, would you tackle a market that is still young or target a tackle markets more like older established, basically? Yeah. So what I'd say is is I'd say if you're if you have the option between two things that you enjoy doing, I would go for one that's already well established.
13:56Yes. There'll be more competition, but the thing is if there's a huge market for it, you know, no single provider is gonna take up the whole market.
14:04You become best meets with one person. They can pay you 10 k a month, and then you're on good amount of money a month, you know. And all you gotta do is meet best friends and network with one individual guy.
14:13So I would say that is a lot easier. But if you're really passionate about something and have a hobby that's only in a new like a newly emerging market, I call it, then I'd say like a 100% go for it, you know. I find it's great fun every day.
14:25You know, I never know what's around the corner. Nobody else has done what I've done before. There's nobody else I can really look up to, and I I find it quite fun.
14:32But I'd say if you want something that's easier to do, I would definitely say do something with a market that's already established. Now valid. I wonder like if I were to go back in time, I've always done, you know, a software that's already in established market.
14:46Right? My take has always been, I'm just the software that's already in this market is outdated, it's old, it's slow, or I'm just gonna make a better one. Right?
14:53And just show people and word-of-mouth will spread as well as adding my own marketing on top of it. Right? You can solely rely on word-of-mouth, especially if the product isn't like a niche in a market where everyone knows everyone.
15:04So that's how I will what was perceived to be like, yeah, I've always never never thought of the idea of like maybe making a product for an emerging bar market. I know recently, I'm working on a product for Reddit because Reddit marketing is on the rise now.
15:15Right? So I guess that's like the closest I've been to tackling like a new market. Because if you can tackle a market when it's like right before it explodes, that's where most of money is made now.
15:24Right? That's where you can really capitalize. So I feel like, for example, Reddit is is a great spot where making software for that niche and right before it explodes, it still hasn't exploded, I think towards the latter end 2026 will probably explode.
15:36So if you're able to capitalize on that wave, that could be huge. Right? And Okay.
15:40So so for anyone who's thinking that they're either too late to start an AI business, right, what would you tell them? A lot of people had this notion that, oh my god, the whole mark the software market SaaS space is saturated. AI business as a whole is saturated.
15:52Everyone's doing this. And I personally don't believe that. I feel like social media algorithms make you think that, but that's my POV.
15:57What would you say is your POV on that? Well, I'd say I mean, I'm guessing a lot of people watching this video are also gonna be watching videos about people saying that, I made this assassin x amount of time and made this amount of money. I mean, that directly shows you that even, like doing a little bit of work can get a little bit of money, especially in this scene and it's not oversaturated
16:14if you make a good product. I'd say what I see a lot of is, especially my niche because it's sass, like people come up, they make a new tool, but they'll have nothing that makes them different from everybody else. They won't have any marketing systems set up and they won't push the product in front of anybody and they won't dedicate at least, like, three to four months to that project, you know, working a lot of time every single day.
16:36Not you don't have to work loads of time, but working a decent amount of time every single day for three months to just see a little bit of money come in. So I'd say it's not necessarily oversaturated.
16:45I'd say that it's the saturated level of the SaaS space is very underdeveloped and anything that actually is very good that's been created or anything that's very good that's come out like something that solves a really good problem and it's really well set up, I'd say that would do really well if you put time and effort into it.
17:00As people on YouTube, they'll make a product and they'll sell it and they'll get money from it because it's actually a good product and they've actually done a good job of selling it. Whereas people at home, you're already coming in with that mindset, so you're bound to not do well anyway because you're gonna lose passion after, you know, like a week, not even that, a few days.
17:18Maybe stick with something and keep going with it, then it'll be great. Now, Lit, I have two more questions. One, your software, we've working together for a couple months now.
17:26It's at $10,000 USD, right, per month plus. What would you say is like your goals now? Like, I know you obviously want the goals as you we made clear
17:35is making a 100 k a month, alright, with your current SaaS. But do you have any other like goals, maybe an idea of a second product, potentially a an agency service, or are you just heads down to software? So at the moment, without giving too much away because I don't want competitors watching and taking my ideas, but obviously, I want to drive and make as much money as possible.
17:56But what I've realized is is not to put lots of my focus on the money, but put more of my focus on providing the best, like, service possible because I think where I also was lacking was the service.
18:10It was good, but I really wanted to sell itself as well. So what I'm focusing on at moment is first of all, all the like smaller jobs that I used to do. I got staff and people, etcetera, that do it for me, which is great.
18:20And kind of loosely distributing those things off to them people. And then more focusing on better free content for people because free content sells really well and it's a great way to kind of attack your market with free content based around your niche and then they also then know about your software or paid service for your free stuff.
18:38So focus on free stuff whether that's free learning materials, free tools in my niche. Tools are quite popular like little computer programs that are free and also making YouTube videos as well. I'm I'm kinda locking down on just because a lot of the niche that I'm in, it's very new and it needs to be pushed out into new markets.
18:57It's not very established at the moment. So if I become one of those voices that becomes part of the kind of movement into making it more well known, then I know that that will also help me out a lot as well. And as long as my service is good, I I don't have a problem selling it.
19:11Yeah. If you're the industry leader, right, and you can actually, like, walk the talk, like, you're almost I won't say guaranteed, but as close to guaranteed as possible in terms of making a shit ton of money. Right?
19:20Because industry leaders, everyone's looking like, once you are aware of the problem, right, they're like, alright, who's the who's the best guy who can help me solve this? Right? Boom.
19:28You're the industry leader. They're obviously gonna go with the guy who's looks like he's the best. Right?
19:31They're gonna go with you and boom, you're able to capitalize on that. Now with that being said, to become an industry leader, I know you say you're investing more into content. Right?
19:39Have you ever considered having a big personal brand or like, you know, have you seen that the personal brand creators on like Instagram where they they document like just building a business in public. Right? Have you thought of doing that?
19:49Because that will be a next move, I'd say. Yeah. So I started doing that, like, building it in public, and it was great.
19:55But it was more like I don't know. I didn't really have the time to build a personal brand. So what I was trying to do instead was was push out more YouTube content, but instead of making it promotional,
20:05kind of making it personal while using what I use in my business because I'm pretty not I wouldn't like, I'm not trying to act a busy saying I'm booked up all the time, but I've always got things going on and making a commitment to a personal brand was difficult for me. So I took what you said about personal brand, kinda applied it to my own thing and instead of the YouTube videos just by downright promoting my tool, I changed it from a business channel into my own personal YouTube channel and then started uploading more content.
20:29Like, I uploaded a con like a piece of content a few days ago, which I think you've seen, which was about like something some news that was occurring in my niche, you know. And I'm always trying these different things while putting my face on it to then kind of help build up my personal brand alongside the business as well.
20:44So I'm trying trying the best that I can with the time that I got, basically. Yeah. Valid.
20:48I know because your specific SaaS, it's solving a very niche problem and that the markets in it is still not problem aware. Right?
20:56Because you try and make them problem aware with their content, you know. Now Yes, sir. What is your advice for p like, if you had to go back in time, would you still wanna do a software that's in a problem a market that has to be problem aware, or you would attack an or would you tackle a market that is already problem aware, they just need to be solution aware?
21:13And they just need a solution for the problem, but everyone understands the problem. Right? Because your market is so young, they don't have the problem.
21:18Not many people know that they have this problem, or if they know it, it's just not mainstream. Right? You're trying to make it more mainstream.
21:24So if you had to say, like, one year from now, where do you wanna be? I hope to be in a a different house, maybe. Nicer house, hopefully.
21:31And I want my company to be more well known, and I wanna have better connections in the scene, you know, higher up connections in the gaming scene. I'd say that's where I wanna be. Yeah.
21:40Valid. Did you buy a car recently? I really Yeah.
21:44Yeah. Yeah. That's ass money coming in.
21:45Yeah. Hey. I was driving around.
21:48I know you guys in UK know a Citroen c one. It's like a like a like an 800 to a thousand pound car. It's like a basic first level car.
21:56And I really just wanted like little treat to myself, you know. Yeah. No.
21:59We deserve it, man. Yeah. Yeah.
22:01No. Well, no. He deserves that.
22:03Have you ever thought of acquisition? I've not we talked about this before. I know you mentioned this, we talked about this before.
22:07Yeah. Remind me the terminology for acquisition one sec. Yeah.
22:10So right now, the SaaS multiple is you take your yearly rep your yearly projected revenue. Right? So let's say you're making three months of like 10 k a month.
22:16Right? So that's a 120 k in the the year. Right?
22:20Dollars. You can sell your software for three to five times its projected annual revenue as acquisition. So you get your software sold, yeah, for 360 to like $600,000
22:29basically. Yeah. Alright?
22:31Today. Not not today, but in the next over the course like two, two and a half months. Right?
22:35So what what is your view on that? Like, have you ever thought of that? Have you considered it?
22:39Or do you just wanna, like, keep scaling? I'll be right. I'm not selling the coffee for anything less than, 10 mils, so I got a lot more work to do.
22:44I'll be so real. Like, the thing is the thing is right. So finding something you enjoy doing a day to day something day to day in your life, this is what somebody very old told me.
22:53He recently retired, one of my grandparents' friends. I asked him, I was like, would you go back and change it?
22:58And he said, yeah, I'd start my own business in photography because he really, really enjoyed photography, but instead, he took, like, the day to day nine to five route. And basically,
23:07you if find something that you enjoy doing and you can make money out of it, then you'll never feel like you work another day in your life again. And that is so rare in this day and age, and that's why I don't want to be bought out. Because the thing is, some some people may say yes.
23:18That's great. But the way my mind will work is as soon as I'm bought out and I've got on what, like $304,100 k for this company,
23:24I will immediately want to go and make another business and then I'll be stuck with the problem I had a couple years ago when I first started is what's something that I can do that I have passion in that I'm actually gonna put my time and effort into because all these other things that I done didn't work and I didn't like them because they weren't my hobby and I wasn't passionate about them to start off with.
23:40You know, doing my hobby day to day as a job is really great. If somebody will buy me out and then reemploy me, maybe I would then think about it, but then I'd still wanna be the person making the decisions because I believe that, you know, I'm a bit delusional. Believe nobody else can do it better than me.
23:55I believe that in this scene that I can take it over and I can take it to certain places without another gaming company buying me out. That's just the way that I think, but acquisition as a whole, I think it would only be something I could consider if they were to buy me out for a good amount of money and then they'd allow me to be reemployed.
24:10Why I say 10,000,000 only is because if I if I'm at 10 mil, then that means I'm making what? What? 3.33
24:16mil a year? So, like, just under 300 k a month. Is that right?
24:19Yeah. Yeah. I mean, the 10 mils would tech technically come out all at once.
24:22It's like a direct check that hits your account, like, all at once. Yeah. Unless they finance it.
24:26Like, they say, hey. We'll pay you 10 mil over the course of, like, three years. Right?
24:30That's different. But yeah. But I'm saying to value my company at 10 mil, it would have to be 300 k a month, like $3,330
24:37k a month or something like that. No. Probably less than that because it it it reads three to five x.
24:41Right? So usually, let's say yeah.
24:44Like, ideally 300 k a month for sure. Alright? Because then you get the three x multiple.
24:48But even if you have it, like, 200 k a month, you may have say 2 mil, right, a year, and the five x multiple at $10,000,000. But, yeah, you see it in the millions range looking like three x to 3.5. Then at that stage, I'd be able to just I think I'll be able to take a step back from the business at that point because then I believe if it was making that much money that time, then I would have completed my mission, is bringing it mainstream,
25:07you know, providing a good service for loads and loads of people, and then I'd be happy to let it go and happy to be take the, you know, the sum check, and then I wouldn't, you know, have that problem in my head when I'm like, right. We'll go start something else. I'd be like, I've done something now.
25:18That's alright. You know? Yeah.
25:20Yeah. That's lit, man. Yeah.
25:21I love that mentality. So, yeah, last question. What's what's next for you?
25:24And what is your what are your what are next for it. But Facts.
25:30Facts. No. Thanks, man.
25:31I appreciate you hopping on the channel and sharing your advice, man. That's why I know Rose at all. Literally, it's always a pleasure.
25:36CTAI mean, I'll be really the only two people that I watch now. It's just you, Alex, or Moozy, nobody really else I, like, care and listen to just because I've been through them and they haven't, you know, been the best or hasn't been great. But, yeah, definitely, you and Alex or Mozzi definitely got the most source out there.
— full transcript
§ 05 · For Joe
Why passion outlasts motivation in early SaaS.
WHAT TO LEARN
The founder who builds inside a niche they already live in has a structural advantage that no amount of discipline or motivation can replicate for someone who chose the idea purely for profit.
- Passion is not soft advice — it is the only mechanism that keeps a founder working through the first three to four months before revenue arrives, when every rational signal says quit.
- Turning a hobby into a SaaS means your marketing language is already calibrated to the audience because you are the audience; you know what they do not know they need.
- Established markets are easier to enter because no single provider holds the whole thing — you only need to out-execute one incumbent for one segment to build a real business.
- Emerging markets reward founders who are already deep insiders; the advantage is not timing, it is knowing the niche well enough to build what competitors cannot easily replicate.
- Consistent volume at adequate quality always compounds over time — the law of large numbers applies to content, sales outreach, and product iterations equally.
- AI content tools degrade faster than human-produced work because platforms detect the pattern; the cost savings evaporate when reach collapses, and a human clipper at modest cost usually outperforms them.
- A business you would run as a hobby does not require sacrifice from the founder — that asymmetry is what lets a 20-year-old outwork experienced founders who chose their market purely for margin.
- Deciding your acquisition floor price before you are close to it clarifies every near-term decision — knowing you will not sell below a certain threshold focuses the work on building to that number.
