§ 01 · The Hook
The bait, then the rug-pull.
Chase Hughes opens cold with a thesis: every piece of news is theater. Inside ninety seconds the cut deck has stacked SIOP susceptibility, Plato's cave, quantum brains, five-to-ten seizures a day, and a methylene-blue-and-mushrooms cure — a hyper-dense supercut sizzle that promises a feature-length excavation of how stories run us, and then delivers exactly that for the next 107 minutes.
Who's talking.
00:00guestChase Hughes
00:00hostCal Callahan
00:00cohostAdam Schell
Where the time goes.
00:00 – 01:35
01 · Cold open: theater + the DMT cure
Rapid-cut sizzle reel previews the entire conversation — Chase's 'news as theater' thesis, SIOP susceptibility, quantum brains, seizures, and the methylene-blue/mushroom turnaround. Sets channel branding.
01:35 – 04:30
02 · Did you get psyoped by Trump?
Cal asks Chase whether his consulting proximity to the administration (Mar-a-Lago, Kash Patel) means he got caught up in political theater. Chase: his brain registers everything as theater without exception, and if politics was about results it wouldn't need performance.
04:30 – 10:00
03 · Plato's cave & Alan Watts on suffering
Chase explains his 'Plato's Cave Search and Rescue Team' identity. Cites the Alan Watts bumper-sticker line: 'Almost all of our suffering comes from taking very seriously what God built for fun.' Cal pushes on the emotional integration of intellectually knowing it's theater.
10:00 – 18:00
04 · Parenting framework: 'What does that person want me to think?'
Chase's signature parenting drill — from age 9 he asked his kids what bumper stickers, loud airport clothing, and strangers were trying to project, then at 10-11 added 'what would they be afraid of if that were true?' Builds empathy as a side-effect of behavior reading.
18:00 – 23:00
05 · Perspective shift as the only PTSD cure
Teach kids to grab their internal 'camera' and zoom out. Psychedelics fix PTSD the same way: not by dropping the trauma backpack, just by changing camera angle on the same memory.
23:00 – 29:00
06 · Trial-consulting trick: make them feel clever
Chase's persuasion model from his trial consulting practice — place two ideas near each other with no explicit link, the brain wires them together, the audience feels clever, and the belief sticks because it 'came from within.' Two scariest things he taught his kids: (1) two ideas with no thread between them, and (2) any grown-up asking them to keep a secret.
29:00 – 36:00
07 · The 'They' game for teenagers
With his 17-year-old's friends asking 'what do we do?' about Epstein/Iran, Cal walks them through what 'they' seem to hate (vulnerability, prayer, real connection, healthy bodies, natural sexuality) — and tells them to just do the opposite. Chase offers to make a one-page infographic.
36:00 – 43:00
08 · Microdosing & the etheric mycelial network
Adam describes seven years of microdosing as having strengthened the heart-head fibers — 'I know when to give, when to receive, when receptors aren't hitting.' Setup for Chase's psychedelic history.
43:00 – 51:00
09 · Temporal-lobe seizures & foreign memories
Chase describes 5–10 seizures a day — paralysis, 60–90s of fake memories from other lives implanted into his 'file cabinet.' One recurring seizure as a Tennessee woman whose address and SSN he could recall; he and his wife later visited the actual house.
51:00 – 56:00
10 · Sudden savant syndrome & the white-crow standard
Argues that thousands of cases of acquired-savant abilities (foreign fluency, instant cello) collapse the 'consciousness is locally generated' theory — one white crow disproves 'all crows are black.'
56:00 – 62:00
11 · Methylene blue + mushrooms = seizures gone in 4 days
First microdose stopped the seizures within four days. Within months his memories 'resorted themselves out.' Brian Johnson's brain glucose normalized during a 5g journey. Russian mice study: +30% telomere length.
62:00 – 69:00
12 · Empathy & boundaries with annoying people
Adam asks how to coach a 14-year-old dealing with an insecure peer. Adam's answer: deepen empathy AND keep boundaries — be loving without being his rescuer.
69:00 – 75:00
13 · Story archetypes — the persuasion master key
There are only 7–8 archetypes, hardwired pre-language for 200,000 years. Chase shows how he places David-and-Goliath cues around a courtroom narrative without ever naming the story — the jury 'completes the archetype' and thinks the verdict was their own idea.
75:00 – 80:00
14 · Why Epstein won't get the Spielberg ending
Everyone's craving a tidy 'big evil monster falls' resolution because that's the archetype we've been trained on. Real life is the tragic-comedy archetype, not the redemption story. Includes Ghislaine-Maxwell-look-alike-in-Quebec digression and Chase's forensic-facial-expert call about the ears.
80:00 – 89:00
15 · Satan's Little Season & the missing 950 years
Cal lays out the Paul-Hobbs / Alex-Zech inserted-time theory: 950 years invented to hide a millennial reign of peace, Tartarian architecture, mud-flood evidence, the 12-month Gregorian calendar replacing a natural 13-month/28-day calendar. We are at the end of a 250-year inversion that started ~1776.
89:00 – 92:00
16 · Hermetic principles — All is Mind
Chase: every psychedelic insight reduces to the seven Hermetic principles. The first two are the foundation: mentalism and correspondence. Adam fills in the remaining five.
92:00 – 97:00
17 · The dream-within-a-dream argument
Chase's spiel: in a dream the distance to the fireplace is made of you. Quantum mechanics shows ~1/3 of your brain's particles aren't here at any given moment. So what if the waking world is just the next layer up?
97:00 – 101:00
18 · Five hours of intravenous DMT
Chase was the 41st person to take IV DMT for five hours (most experiences are 8–20 min). Done for neurogenesis/BDNF on a brain scan showing 38% non-functioning. Beings shoved him onto a steel table, opened his torso with shears, drilled into his nose. His wife had silently prayed over the vials the night before for his heart and brain — and that's exactly the first order of business the entities went to.
101:00 – 104:00
19 · Coming back & 'death by astonishment'
He didn't want to come back. Cried, asked 'am I dead' 39 times. Took weeks to integrate. McKenna's phrase: death by astonishment. We make DMT in our own bodies, and it's still a felony.
104:00 – 107:00
20 · MaxStack pitch & the dying-regrets test
Adam pitches the Brain Supreme MaxStack — ceremonial cacao + Ceylon cinnamon + 22 ingredients designed to complement micro/macrodosing. Chase: the only test that matters for 'how to win at life' is the regrets of dying people.
107:00 – 108:24
21 · Chase's new TV station + sign-off
Chase is building a Virginia-based daily news channel formatted as a CIA-style intelligence brief — open bank-account ledger, public-by-default correspondence, fact-only, designed to expose what's being used as a distraction. Cal/Adam close on the merch room.
Lines you could clip.
00:00
"No matter what's on the news, my brain 100% registers it all as theater."
00:14
"Anybody who thinks they're not susceptible to a SIOP is completely susceptible to a SIOP."
00:22
"If politics was about results, it wouldn't require a lot of attention. It wouldn't require performance."
15:35
"Almost all of our suffering comes from taking very seriously what God built for fun."
25:00
"I can get you to do anything because I just get you to feel clever."
27:00
"The two scariest things: two ideas with nothing between them, and any grown-up who asks you to keep a secret."
34:10
"Just do the things the 'they' seem to hate, and you're gonna build an amazing life."
70:20
"Your brain, when you go to deliberate, you think it's your decision. All you're doing is completing the story archetype."
73:00
"All of us are deeply internally craving a Steven Spielberg ending for this shit."
98:15
"The only way to enjoy anything is to forget that you are God."
103:00
"DMT is big. It's big in a way that you cannot fathom, describe, comprehend, imagine, or even come close to understanding how big DMT is."
105:20
"Look at the regrets of dying people. You will see the code to life."
Things they pointed at.
08:55bookPlato — Allegory of the Cave
15:35channelAlan Watts (philosopher / quote source)
79:10toolGhislaine Maxwell forensic-facial-expert consult
81:40channelPaul Hobbs (Satan's Little Season researcher)
81:40channelAlex Zech podcast
90:00bookSeven Hermetic Principles (The Kybalion)
97:00channelAndrew Gallimore (DMT hyperspace researcher)
97:00productGalantamine (lucid-dreaming aid / Alzheimer's drug)
103:20channelTerence McKenna — 'death by astonishment'
104:40channelBrian Johnson (Don't Die / biohacker)
105:00productMomentous creatine monohydrate
107:30channelJP Sears
107:30channelTim Dillon
107:30channelEric Godsky — 'the death cookie'
108:00productChase Hughes — upcoming Virginia news channel (CIA-briefing format)
Word for word.
HOOK opening / re-engagementCTA the pitch metaphor analogy story
00:00HOOKNo matter what's on the news, my brain 100% . You had this great line. Anybody who thinks they're not susceptible to a SIOP is completely susceptible. If politics was about results, it wouldn't require
00:15HOOKa lot of attention. It wouldn't require performance. . We'll see how the season ends. We'll see how the, you know, the season finale. We've got understandings of psychology, sociology, therapy, hypnotherapy,
00:28HOOKneuroanatomy, brain science. And now the last four or five years, you've thrown yourself into psychedelics. My first mushroom journey was me trying to just process what consciousness is. I was having between five to 10 seizures a day. And these are temporal lobe seizures. You're not shaking or anything like that. You lose all muscle control. It's terrifying because, like, you're losing control of your whole entire body and your mind at the same time. It takes me three or four weeks to come back to normal. My seizures stopped within four days of taking methylene blue and mushrooms. Within just a few months, all my memories, like, re sorted themselves out. The most modern discoveries in quantum mechanics and quantum neuropsychology
01:09HOOKare starting to prove that our brains are quantum. Like, one third of the particles inside of our brain are existing in some other place. What the fuck is going on? Like, where the are we in reality? Even if it's just I know, I don't know. Here's the biggest one. If we can go on a little deep end tangent. Please. A little deeper than before.
01:42Last time we we did a podcast together, you had this great line. You're talking about anybody who thinks they're not susceptible to a SIOP is completely susceptible to a SIOP. Yeah. And I was thinking a lot about this as well because, you know, with the last election,
01:59it seemed that things were just so bad. Like when you have an understanding of SIOPs and and how we're being lied to and manipulated, the last administration was so bad. It was so egregious. I mean, it didn't even seem like our president was our president. They were changing bodies and faces and ear lobes and chins, and it was so fucking bizarre. So hoping that Trump could be somebody different, you know, with my, you know, with some serious caveats and reservations, I threw my support and energy and belief behind it hoping.
02:32And now I feel like, oh, I was completely psyoped. And I know that you had kind of I don't know if you still are, but for a time period, you were kind of in the, like, the outer inner circle, like going to Mar A Lago and getting invited to some of the think tank things and seem to have some interaction with Kash Patel and maybe Danny Bojjinga. I've never even know how to pronounce his name. But like,
02:53how are you feeling as a SIOP expert? Did you get a little SIOP? Did you get caught, or did you were you just going along for the to see what would happen, career aspirations and trajectory? Like, given what's happened with the administration, how are you feeling right now? Did you get hustled? I don't think I did.
03:14Only got involved with people that are adjacent to the administration through trial consulting. So it's not like they sought out me for any political Mhmm. Reason at all. But I have this thing in my brain
03:30where no matter what happens, no matter what's on the news, my brain 100% registers it all without any exception as theater.
03:42And there's no exception in my brain. Even if, like, there's real stuff going on, my brain registers it all as theater. And the one thing I I told my kids is if politics was about results, it wouldn't require a lot of attention. It wouldn't require performance and cameras and all this kind of stuff. They would just do the results, and and that would be important.
04:05So no matter what I see, and the moment I start to I hear something on the news, and I'll start to feel like, oh, shit. That's gonna be amazing. I get excited about it. That little part of my brain smacks it down and be like, that you're watching a play. You're watching a movie right now. And if you just kind of approach it from that angle, you're you're just kind of like, well, we'll see how the season ends. We'll see how the, you know, the season finale.
04:30Yes. And that's what it is. How long did that that kind of intellectual now into emotional
04:39process transformation take?
04:43From really like when you first recognize it? Because I think like Cal and I, like, oh, we know this is theater, but I still get caught up on like, damn it. Freely, come on. You know? Yeah. I think it it took maybe a year of just like only because I dug into it. So if you just read Plato,
05:04he warned us about all this shit Mhmm. So long ago. Plato invented the matrix. But you know the concept of the movie the matrix with the Plato's allegory of the cave. And that I have merch in our store, like one of our t shirts that we sell at my company has a a big logo on it right here that says Plato's cave search and rescue team.
05:27Yes. Just because I I kinda got addicted to I wanna wake as many people up as I can. Feels like and I don't say this like, oh, look how awake I am. Mhmm. I'm not awakened fully. I don't think there's anybody a 100% awakened or anything,
05:44but I just have this craving in me to dedicate the rest of my life to exposing the theater of it all, and we don't need to like expose a whole lot of people and name names and be one of those YouTubers who pisses people off and leaves you upset about stuff. But just exposing like all if you go back to one quote from Alan Watts, and I have no idea what the your question even was that I'm answering right now, but the you the how long did the genesis take in your own
06:13Yeah. Mind and demeanor before? Like, I understand we're living in theater to like now being completely emotionally objective and not getting caught up. You said about a year. Yeah. Yeah. And I've never put a bumper sticker on any of my vehicles, but I did finally about a month ago. And it's an Alan Watts quote. It says, almost all of our suffering comes from .
06:42And I think that's that's the real thing. Like, if if somebody is actually awakening, there's no moment of enlightenment where you feel better than anybody. You just be like, wow. And you kind of feel a little embarrassed. Like, I took all that shit so seriously. I thought everything was such a big deal. I thought I was such a big deal. Look how special I am. Mhmm.
07:03And then you just it's so relaxing. I think it's peaceful, but it's I think it's boring at first. Yeah. I agree. I think in my just journey, and
07:13certainly not to where you are with the theater,
07:17I can bite for it a little bit. And also the the the kind of overcorrection is like, this is all a fucking joke. There's know, so you can get a little bit negative about it. And I think where I've landed is, holy fuck, this is so interesting. And and what I try to remind my friends that are in the inquiry of, you know, certainly with your work and what the fuck is going on, it's like, yeah, it's it's like, let's not take it too seriously. Like, what a timeline that we're in right now. Holy shit. Everything is getting
07:50exposed. And instead of going down into the darkness, which I know you and I have talked about going down these rabbit holes, like it's dark, and I think it's necessary to explore them. But to live there, you will just see darkness everywhere. But just to get like what you need and pop out of it,
08:09and then just watch it all unfold, and allow everyone to be where they're at, and through conversations like this, try to meet different people where they're at to further expose what's going on
08:22so that they can eventually live in this this orientation that, okay. Like, let's just be love and light. Like, let's not come in, again, too negative on this stuff. Mean, I some people you do need to shake their shoulders a little bit and be like, dude, what the fuck? How do you not see this? But also it's I think it's fascinating.
08:43And, yeah, there's a lot of dark shit out there. There are people that are being manipulated just like we have been throughout the course of our lives. And yeah, there's this moment like,
08:57wow, what a fucking idiot. I believed all this stuff. Then when you thought it was all real. When you can see the humor in it and just laugh at yourself, like Yeah. Holy shit. The hard part is children, man. It's like, you know, you've got you've got two teenagers still. Three. Three. Yeah. So
09:17Well, you asked this question Yeah. Talked we talked about this at men's group, but I I can kind of do my spiel in a minute. But how do you the whole, even though it might have been false, the the fabric and foundation of society that we could have some stable footing of. Like when we were all kids, you know, we might have thought our government was scummy,
09:38but we didn't necessarily now have evidence that there's psychotic baby eating occultists, you know, who gather for sex and blood ritual. You know? How do you talk to your teenagers about the world that we're living in? You know? Like, how
09:54how are you counseling and advising them? I'd love to I'm sure a lot of parents would love to hear that. So I I brought them up with one big question in their head about other when it comes to other human beings. So every time we encountered any situation,
10:13I would ask them, what does that person want me to think about them? So what what do they want to show? Mhmm. And then that was until they were about nine years old. So they would see bumper stickers on the back of some Subaru or something with Marathon running and like Ron John Surf Shop and all those kind of Yeah. Oh, yeah. All that kind of stuff. And I and I'd ask my daughter like, what what do they want us to think based on this? What does the car want us to think? Not what is it telling us. What does it want us to think? Those are two different things.
10:47So my daughter would be like, well, I run marathons. I'm healthy. I go surfing, and it talks about communities, the fraternity they were in. And so it says I make good friends. I have good friends. I'm in a lot of communities,
11:02and it also means I'm a nice person, and I'm gonna be a good friend to you, and I'd like to be a friend to somebody. And then I 10, 11 years old, we kept going,
11:14and like, what would they be afraid of if that was true? And that's question number two. And then you start seeing so you cannot help but have empathy if you start seeing the world that way unless you're a psychopath. Like, you're seeing it in everybody else, but not yourself.
11:32So, like, in the first stages of their life, it's what is what is that thing or that person want me to to feel about them? It's like somebody walking through an airport with really obnoxious loud clothing on. What do they want me to think? Not I need attention. That's not what they want you to think.
11:49That's what that's saying. Right? So the difference is, I I need attention, or I want you to pay attention to me. And what is that what would they be afraid of if that were true is question number two. So the the way you would answer that is like, well, what if they didn't if I didn't think what he wanted, that would mean what for them? That would mean isolation,
12:12being ignored, and ultimately being lonely. So we see somebody like that that has this loud shit on in an airport that's kind of annoying at first, and then you realize
12:23this is a fear of loneliness. And all of a sudden you see yourself. You see the loneliness that you're trying to hide, that you hide from your friends. You see the shame that you conceal from from everybody when you're on Zoom meetings or at work, and you're just like, holy shit. Everybody's suffering. Everyone's suffering. And I think it gives you a tremendous amount of empathy.
12:48The second level of this is
12:52just having your kids get into the mindset of being able to zoom out and teaching your kids as early as possible about camera angle. So, like, if I can just move your camera and
13:07drastically change your perspective of situation, I can fix PTSD. That's what fixes PTSD. That's why people go on a giant mushroom journey or a psychedelic journey, and they're like, wow, my PTSD is gone. It's perspective shifting is the only thing that really happens there. So we have like loneliness, depression, PTSD,
13:28getting pissed off at the world, like you wanna tell your friends it's not a big deal, like focus, like focus on the good things. If you just shift perspective, you can solve so many problems that that people have,
13:43and teaching your kids to grab their little camera and be aware, cognizant of I'm looking at this from this little angle right here. I'm zoomed in on one little fiber of this carpet right here. When if I just took your camera and zoomed out like you do on Google Maps to where you can see the stars, like, behind the the planet and stuff, that that fiber is not important anymore.
14:06Like, start to see, oh, it's not a big deal. So it's it's all about not just zooming out, but viewing something from a more mature perspective, even if it's in your past. Like, that thing happened to you in middle school. I got kicked in the balls from a lot of kids in middle school, and it was really embarrassing, and I feel like that permanently scarred me. But just going back and kind of revisiting that from a mature perspective,
14:30the perspective shift is the only thing that needs to change. You don't need to like drop a backpack full of trauma and and drop it on the ground. If I just teach my kids and my friends maybe to change perspective, and that they are in control of perspective, you can make such a shift in people's lives. That was a super long answer to your question. And I think the follow-up would be,
14:52because this is this pertains to what you're bringing up, what about your your kid's friends who are coming to you and they're like, okay, dude. What the fuck is going on? And they're living in a home that maybe still believes this is not theater, this is all like, yeah, the government's taking care of you and the FDA's taking care of you and everyone's got your best interest in mind.
15:15How do you kind of plant seeds for them because they're they're seeing something in you that is more resonant? They don't quite understand it because they've been brainwashed, let's How do you start to open that up in a in a kind of intentional way where you're not breaking their brain when they're not quite ready for it even though that may be the best thing to happen. Yeah.
15:41I would and I have done this with some of my kids' friends, and it's just the same question. You're just taking it on a larger scale. You're saying like when
15:52you consume this media or when you watch this thing, just teaching them to ask themselves the question like, what do they want me to believe right now? What are they asking me to believe, and what's the assumption that's being made right now? And typically what I'll teach my kids friends is the way I'm a trial I work as a trial consultant, which is where a lot of my income comes from.
16:16I know nothing about the law for the record here.
16:20But when it happen when this happens, the way that I am able to win trials, and the way that you can persuade anybody if you're a leader or a boss, is .
16:36That's it. Mhmm. So I'll have one idea here and one idea here, and I'll I'll get your brain to think, oh, you know what? I bet those things . And if I can get you to feel clever, then
16:53you will automatically accept the idea because it came from within. Anything that comes from within our own mind, we cannot resist. Mhmm. So all I have to get you to do is adopt this new belief without telling you what to think. It's exactly the same as when you're watching the news and they're like, a local Austin woman found missing today. Neighbors report that earlier today she was seen arguing with her boyfriend.
17:16Details after the break. But then like you're watching that and you're like, oh, I know what happened. And you get that little moment of feeling clever just because these two little details get put in front of you. And if you can do that in life,
17:31you can get people to do a lot. But so instead of doing this to those kids, I'm teaching the kids about when there's two pieces of information and there's no string between them. They make you put the string
17:44between the ideas. That should terrify you, and that should be very scary. The only two things I ever told my kids should terrify them. Number one, when you have two ideas and nothing in between them, and you your brain starts putting them together, number one. And number two is if any grown up in the world ever asks you to keep a secret.
18:06Can you can you expand upon the first one where there's two ideas and and there's not a thread between them? Yeah. Flush that out for me a little bit. Yeah. So just like the news thing. So if someone says
18:23this geopolitical conflict is happening, at the same time they're saying that this person is in trouble in this country,
18:34and you're not getting a string between them. Mhmm. But they they're pushing the ideas close enough together where you're like, oh, I bet this Saudi prince was involved with this attack on this one thing. Just because, you know, ideas are always magnetic, especially
18:50if they have any anything in common. So I get any two ideas close enough to each other, they become magnetic in your brain, but you're the one that assembles them. Okay. So basically what you're saying is that's that's classic media manipulation? Yes. So you're you're teaching your kids to be aware of media manipulation? Yeah. It's classic manipulation for everything. Yeah. In courtrooms
19:11Right. You could win a lot of trials just getting good at that one skill. Right. I had an interesting moment with the my 17 year old was over with four or five friends, and they were all talking about the Epstein files and and the, you know, at the time of this shooting, we're in, I don't know, the fifteenth or sixteenth day of this Iran war,
19:32and all the kids were talking about it. And, you know, I asked the kids. I'm like, alright. So because they they because they said to me, one of the kids is like, what do we do? Like, you know, we're we're juniors. We're about to be seniors. Like, we play football. Like, we're looking at colleges. Like like, what do we do? And I was like, well, interesting time to be alive. That's for sure. Like the foundations that generations before you could stand upon, even if they were false, there was firm footing there, you know, and we could build a life. And now you're like walking on
20:04. And everywhere you step, it's unstable, and it's tittering and tottering. I'm like and there really seems to be like a they. You know? So there there's the proverbial they, there really seems to be a they. Yeah. So I asked the kids, I'm like, what is it that the they seem to hate? Because they seem to definitely hate certain things and point wanna point you in certain ways. So like, what do they hate? And the kids are like I'm like, do they seem to hate like vulnerability and authenticity? Because they certainly want you stuck on your phones all the time. They're like, yeah. So I'm like, well, they do they do they seem to love God, or do they seem to hate God? They're like, well well, they seem to kinda hate God. Like, do they seem to love prayer and meditation, or they seem to hate it? They're like, well, they seem to hate that.
20:47Do they do they want you having like authentic and real connections? Like, with friends and some of them? No. They kind of want us on our phones. I'm like, right. Right. Do they want you watching pornography or having like natural romantic relationships where your sexuality can evolve? They're like, no. They kind of want us watching pornography. I'm like, right. Do they want you healthy and robust, or do they want you kind of sickly and stupid?
21:12They're like, no. Sick. So I was like making those connections. I'm like, so if you just do the things as a young person that the they seem to hate, you're gonna build an amazing life. Like, you're gonna have authentic connection. You're gonna know when to put your friend you know, your phone down and really connect with your peers and your friends. You're gonna put down pornography and you're gonna have like natural romantic relationships where your sexuality can involve without some false expectation of what sexuality is supposed to be. You know, you're gonna eat foods that feel good and natural to your body. You're gonna have clean water and like just embrace your youth.
21:47Fully embrace your youth and literally think of the system, the they, and all the things that they want you to do and kind of just do the opposite, and you're going to fucking rock your teenage years. And until the world completely blows up, go ahead and try to be an all state football player or great at lacrosse or, you know, whatever your aspirations are, fully engage in them, you know.
22:09And it was it was a real like revelation for the kids. But part of it was there. Like, I was questioning them, and they were they were putting the pieces together. Like, there really is a they, just think of the things that all that they want you to do and the things that they seem to hate and just go the other way. You need to make that into like a one page PDF. Oh.
22:28That would be such a great infographic to kind of visually show all of those things. Yeah. I'll have my team do it actually. I'll have just give me a list, and I'll have my team put a really cool graphic together.
22:43You know what's interesting? Wanted to ask you too. This is like shamelessly self serving, but product bumps. Serve away. No. But my I'm 55. And but like seven years of microdosing
22:57have totally transformed the way that I think and draw connection and see the threads that you're talking about. Like so and you're such an interesting guy. So first, know, like kind of like, you know, school of hard knocks. You're in the military as a young person. You had some like ridiculous thing that happened. I remember you told me where you you were college bound, and then something happened in high school, and you got thrown way off track over something that was really kind of stupid.
23:22So military, and then you you find this aspiration, this great interest in in in brain study, and then you become self educated going through traditional, nontraditional avenues, become this world class brain expert. So you've got understandings of psychology,
23:39sociology, you know, therapy, hypnotherapy, neuroanatomy,
23:45brain science. You're a leader. And now the last four or five years, you've thrown yourself into psychedelics. Yeah. Like, how has talk
23:56to us about what the psychedelics at the macro and micro dosing level have kind of done to transform your brain, your thought processes, your even your emotional you know, going from intellectual understanding to emotional resonance. Yeah. Because I found that microdosing has totally helped with the intellectual understanding to emotional resonance. Like what you had said about
24:17witnessing theater to fully like emotionally understanding this is theater, and I'm not going to get too caught up. I think over time my first mushroom journey was me trying to just process what consciousness is,
24:33and I was having between five to 10 seizures a day, and these are temporal lobe seizures.
24:41So to kind of give you a brief glimpse of what a temporal lobe seizure is, you're not shaking or anything like that. You're just kind of like like you're you lose all muscle control, like you just got injected with a paralytic. That's terrifying because like you're losing control of your whole entire body and your mind at the same time.
25:00And the very beginning of it, it's like a roller coaster sensation. Like, you're just sitting there talking at dinner or something, and it's like roller coaster sensation, and then deja vu that is so powerful
25:13that it feels like everyone in the entire room is setting you up. Like they all everyone in the room has access to your memories, and they're doing something to you on purpose. Mhmm. And then then the seizure starts, and that's like two seconds long. It's just a really rapid downhill. And the seizure is sixty to ninety seconds,
25:34but in that sixty to ninety seconds you're going to it's like massive psychedelics almost, and in some of these seizures I I have you're getting memories. Let's say you're getting memories from like 35 people's different lives over the course of like thirty five years,
25:54and they're randomly like, we have our memories are a little file cabinet. During the seizure, all of those memories from other some other people's life, other person's life is getting put into your files, and all of your folders are getting full of these false memories. And then so if you just if I just have one seizure,
26:13it takes me three or four weeks to come back to normal where I'll remember doing something that never happened in my life. And then several times I had this one
26:27seizure that was recurring where I would look down. I have memories of looking down and seeing breasts and being a woman, and I remember
26:37I took it somehow out of the seizure one time, because seizures come with amnesia. But I know this woman's social security number. I know her phone number, her street address. I have memories of her being lonely.
26:51Me it's me. I remember vacuuming my house, and my wife and I actually went there in in Tennessee, and it it's that was my house. Well, you went to you you you visited the home? Yeah. Because I've been I think I mentioned this briefly in the last podcast we all did together. I've been in the like literally the immediate aftermath of when you had your first seizure in I think eighteen months or two years was when we went out for your dinner Yeah. At your birthday and it's a there's a vibration coming off you, this disorientation.
27:24It's like terrifying and heart wrenching to be around. But when we sat down at dinner and you were kind of integrating a little bit, you were talking about the yellow sweeping the floor. You were in a nineteen seventies kitchen. You were sweeping the floor. You were a woman, and you recalled the yellow post it note on the old pull lever refrigerator,
27:47and you literally knew the numbers. It was a phone number. Mhmm. And we we and the person we left it in with, Rosie, wrote down the phone number, she actually tried to call it. But then you went even deeper, and you you recalled the, like, street address and location. So is that the home from that seizure that you went back to? Yes. Yeah. Same one. Like, third party validation, like, totally real, fucking terrifying. But
28:08I don't claim that it's some past life. I don't claim you know, I mean, I don't have access to the records or anything, but like I remember being in that house even when we when we looked at it. And I don't I don't claim to know what that is. I think the more certainty somebody has around this shit, the more full of shit they are. Mhmm. I don't know what that is, and like just trying to explain reality itself is hard enough,
28:33much less this break from reality. So that was a super long way to just say that I I wanted to start I wanted to do some psychedelics so I can kind of like access that state on demand
28:46HOOKand kind of start exploring what is consciousness. Because I just reading about people that get sudden savant syndrome. Have you ever heard of this? Mhmm. Or somebody get in a car accident or something or fall off a ladder, and all of a sudden they don't speak English anymore, and they speak fluent French, and they can play the cello. Mhmm.
29:07HOOKI would I would love for any scientist in the world to explain how that's possible, and there are thousands of cases. And if there's a if there's a theory that we generate our own consciousness, and we we generate our own memories, and we don't have access to some collective field. This is a mountain of stuff that says otherwise, a mountain.
29:29HOOKSo if somebody has a theory that all crows are black, how many white crows would it take to fully and completely obliterate that theory? Yeah. It would only take one. One. And there's not just one single piece of proof. There's just a massive mountain of it just that we don't know what consciousness is. So I got curious about it, and my seizures stopped within
29:54HOOKfour days of taking methylene blue and and mushrooms, and it was just a regular microdose. And within just a few months, all of my memories like resorted themselves out like my file clerk. It felt like every time I was doing any journey or something that the file clerk would kind of go down there and take take some hours and hours and go through everything and figure out, oh, that one's not Chase's memory. I'm gonna throw it out. This one's Chase's. I'm gonna file it up and to kind of get organized again.
30:25HOOKAnd I think over time, it's just the level of empathy that I developed. Mhmm. I was I don't want to say narcissistic, but I was very self centered, and I was very much purchased in, invested in the idea of separation.
30:41HOOKMhmm. That I'm separate from you, that we're not connected in any way. I need to be better than other people. I want to compete in business instead of collaborate, and that's how I started my civilian careers in that kind of
31:01HOOKjust had access to this stuff. And I mean, even Johns Hopkins is calling it like the most effective drug they ever tested. Mhmm. I'm probably paraphrasing poorly, but if you just look at the results, it's the most effective psychotherapy drug ever tested in the world. Yeah. New thing too with this Russian mice study where it increased telomere length by 30% as well.
31:24HOOKReally? Yes. And then Brian Johnson, you know, the kind of, like, self promoting biohacker, he did a brain analysis on glucose that we did a full brain analysis. And even though his glucose levels were, like, in the top 1%,
31:38HOOKlike, his blood sugar corrected over the course of a six hour five gram mushroom journey from like what would be somebody who's diabetic to completely nondiabetic. So they even think it can correct like blood sugar levels and so forth. It could be a diabetes cure. Wow. It was crazy. Yeah. I had no idea. Yeah. And this is psilocybin. This is psilocybin.
32:01HOOKThis is this is psilocybin. Yeah. I found that I the I have this thing that I talk about, the the kind of etheric mycelial network,
32:13HOOKwhich is the connection from my heart and like my head and making authentic connection. And over the seven years of microdosing, like, those fibers are just so much more pronounced and clear. And and like I know when to give. I know when to receive. I know when the receptors are just not hitting. You know, they're hitting kind of stone. Yeah. Which is something I wanted to ask you about with young kids because you know, as a as a as a conscientious dad raised you know, who's like highly sees the world and all this
32:37HOOKcharade of insanity that's kind of parade and charade of insanity that's happened before us. So if if you can deepen your kids' empathy so like my my son, my my 14 year old son, there's a kid at school who is so self promoting and so threatened by other people's excellence and size and physicality,
32:58HOOKand he's always like messing with and testing. And so I've gotten my son to like deepen his empathetic thinking like, okay. Why is what's driving this behavior? Why is this person like this? You know, what do you think is going on in their home? So like he's deepened his empathy, and he doesn't have like the rage or the anger. But like, what does he do about somebody when somebody's still so fucking annoying? So when somebody's so crippled by their own vanity and insecurity,
33:21HOOKand especially as a young person, like, they're just vomiting that all over you on a daily basis, the part that I fell short on is like, I can help him deepen his perspective and his empathy, but I didn't know, like, I can't tell him to go up and give another 14 year old a hug in the middle of school. Like, that's not necessarily gonna work. So what's your like, what's your advice on when you when you
33:40HOOKpull the camera out and your children now have the deeper perspective, but they're still dealing with another annoying teenager? Like, how do they handle that? I I actually have a thought because I think the same thing holds true. I'd be curious to to get your thoughts as well, Chase. For adults Mhmm. It's I think it comes down to boundaries,
33:59HOOKand there are different levels to where he should let that kid in. He can still be loving and kind and
34:07HOOKnot his best friend, and then just keep him at a distance. And I think part of that awareness for the other kid is maybe he needs to reorient and
34:21HOOKit it I don't know. I think there I've made the mistake in the past of I mean, I've certainly been like that, like fuck that guy. Right? And then I've been like, oh, this poor guy, okay, let me be there and like try to be a good friend.
34:39HOOKAnd then I let them in too far, and then I get, you know, I don't wanna say I get taken advantage of because I'm actually very active in in that relationship, and so that's on me
34:51HOOKto to not have the discernment about where does this person actually fit in my world. Yeah. And so I think it can be very much an empowering thing to be aware of those things, be curious, be loving and empathetic as you said Yeah. But also like not trying to fucking rescue or save anybody. Well, mean, as adults, we can as adults, we can kind of we can let the cat out of the bag, we can talk about it. But like what's a trick for a 14, 15, or 16 year old who's like
35:21HOOKwho's in a very kind of hot testosterone like interaction with somebody where they're just vomiting their insecurity and bragging and all
35:34HOOKhow would you advise a 14 or 17 year old to kind of handle that when they're in that type of situation? What's the technique point? Same as an adult. One word, archetypes. Understanding story archetypes.
35:47HOOKThere's only about seven or eight, some say 12 story archetypes that are woven into our DNA, and our brains haven't changed in two hundred thousand years. So like the archetype of
36:00the wounded healer, the savior, the victim, the tragedy mindset,
36:07the the broken hero, the dark hero. So, like, there's some, like, basic story archetypes, and no matter what you look at, whether it's Toy Story
36:17or It or The Dark Knight, they're following these identical things that have been told from time immemorial before recorded history. These stories were kind of passed down and told. That's why they stick with us. That's why you haven't seen a new story archetype. Mhmm. Like, you don't see Hollywood come up with it, oh, guess what we did.
36:38No. It's the same stuff because that's what resonates with our the lowest most powerful parts of our brain. So and I'll take this back to court just really quick to show you. If I'm if I'm trying to persuade a jury, and let's say I'm working and my client is suing a big company, the client that I'm working for. They're suing a a big company.
37:02I don't have to mention David and Goliath. I might just mention a few topics about it to put the archetype of of David and Goliath in your head. Mhmm. And then I might mention a couple of times when you're waiting in line at the DMV for hours and hours and hours, and every other little situation where there's a big company who doesn't give a shit about you.
37:25And then I'll mention walking down the hill to fight a battle. I'll never say David and Goliath directly, but I'll put that story front and center in your mind. And if I can if I get you to see that this is David and Goliath, that has a beginning and an end. I'm not putting you at the end.
37:43I I never I never ever ever talk about how the story ends because your brain already knows. I'm talking about this is the moment that this occurs. So your brain, when you go to deliberate in the jury room, you think that it's your decision, but all you're doing is . So that's the natural resolution.
38:05So if you if you know the story archetype, and I can I can change your view of a situation to see it as a certain archetype, I can I can make you do anything because it's the natural next step in the story?
38:19So what this means in conversation is I've got this friend who is bitching and complaining and all that kind of stuff. My initial response is gonna be to kind of, hey, man. It's not that bad, or kind of maybe back away from which is great. Like, just spend less time with them and figure out a way to get them at their best. So that's what I always say to people with you got negative family members or something. Figure out a way to only be there when they're at their best,
38:47But you have to understand that this person is in an in a story arc, and they're in a hero's journey of their own. But he might be or she is in this little victim story, and
39:02what they're doing to you by like pulling you down is pissing you off because it's pulling you out of your story arc. You wanna be successful. You wanna be confident. You wanna be happy, and then you're trying to bring them up. Guess what you're doing? You're pulling them out of their story arc. So the first thing you need to do is understand that like they're in an archetype. Mhmm. So
39:25if somebody is in this like downtrodden, beat down kind of mindset, they're in some kind of story. It might be a tragedy, but it might be a case of redemption. Then maybe the next chapter for them is when they learn the magic lesson or something, but it's never gonna be in the school hallway. It's not gonna be over
39:42a brunch or something where they get a piece of information. It's gonna be it has to be a transition because that's what the movies tell us. And you see all this shit with with Epstein, and everybody's upset with Epstein. Why? Because all of us are deeply internally craving a for this shit.
40:03We think that we need this we need the the story archetype to completely unfold. Big evil monster, and then big evil monster's friends, and then every movie we've ever seen in our entire life completes that story archetype with some big nasty thing happening to all of them and them all disappearing like the terminators.
40:24But what we don't realize is that those archetypes are wired into our brain, number one, without language. It's just the story can be in your brain without any any words. The story's still there. And two,
40:37that governs how we all of our shoulds, like they should be punished. They should go to jail. This should happen. Our shoulds are typically governed by little story arcs that we don't realize are playing out in our own mind. So that's a lot of like what we're seeing now. We don't get the Spielberg ending. Mhmm. And that's a hard right. That's the difficult part is that lack of resolution,
41:01and people can see how they want it to end. And so the more they want it to end like that, the less likely it's going to end like that. Right? Because we are creating this whole And so so the people listening now who
41:14are ready to like get the bad guys, have them, you know, with their pound of flesh, which clearly I think in our experience
41:24with people that are very high powered, it's never going to end that way. They're either going to get you know, fakely unalived and brought somewhere and other actors are going to be in. There's a lot of that going on right now, which I think is pretty new for people to understand, certainly for me. Like, oh shit. Like these people may not have died,
41:49and they may be taken somewhere. Yeah. And so I hired a forensic facial expert to look at one of these things of Ghislain Maxwell.
42:00There is someone from Canada where somebody walked past her and said Ghislain, and she turned. She was in Canada. She had a hat on like on a street in Quebec. I haven't seen that. Oh. That was some of the lady that they brought up to be questioned. Oh, yeah. Yeah. With the fat nose and different ears and everything. Yeah. And it show so this woman was we we did this whole interview for a YouTube video, and it's so controversial I decided I'm not gonna make a video about it.
42:24But I don't know. I'm not I'm no expert, so I called this this woman, and she said the ears are just like fingerprints, and you can't change your ears, and you can't change your fingerprints.
42:36And she said this is a different person, and I don't claim to be an expert on it, but that's that's terrifying and hilarious
42:47at the same time. It's just like the tragic comedy archetype. We think we're in the redemption thing where the bad guy goes to jail. We're in I think this is like the tragic comedy story. We're in the wrong we're thinking of the wrong story type. Are you familiar with the concept of Satan's little season? No. Okay. So the idea is that basically I just love having him here. He comes in with these just
43:13So the the idea is that we we had about nine hundred to a thousand years inserted into our timeline, that the whole notion of the dark ages is complete fallacy. And it was basically done to
43:26steal property, to create new power centers. So the concept of Satan's little season little season is that
43:37Christ, about fifty years, came back after his birth, resurrection, then ascension,
43:45and then came after crucifixion, and then resurrection, and ascension came back, and then there was the what's called the millennial reign. And the millennial reign was about a thousand years of peace and prosperity. That's where we get Tartarian buildings. That's why all these capitals and that have this extraordinary architecture that just doesn't make any sense when you really look at it in terms of time, place, capacities,
44:07workforce, population sizes. Like, none of our none of the major capitals throughout The United States and most of the world make any sense when you realize the means of the means of architecture, the comparative architecture styles with the main buildings versus the dwellings where most people live. Wow. Like, it just doesn't make any sense. You can go to Chicago with a new set of eyes. We both spent a lot of time in Chicago. Like,
44:28it's unbelievable. I mean, you know, the the Museum of Art, the Museum of Industry, I mean, just doesn't make any sense given how far they had to go. So the idea is that Christ survived. He had a millennial reign of a thousand years. This was Tartaria, free energy, and so forth, and all these buildings. And then right about 1776
44:47Is this in another dimension or are they saying this happened here? This happened here. Then in 1776, the millennial reign ended and the little season began. And this is two hundred and fifty years where Satan has the run of the land and the rule of the land, and everything's inverted.
45:03So we live in an inverted world where, you know, corruption is rewarded, and there's a there's a YouTube guy, scholar,
45:13podcaster named Paul Hobbs, who was actually on Alex Zech's podcast, really went into the whole little season. And gosh, does it make sense that they basically fake the dark ages in order to totally disorient us in this world. Yeah. Humans. Yeah. Humans fake the dark ages, and that basically time has happened much faster. I mean, you think about it in some ways,
45:35could humans really have nine fifty years where we just don't evolve at all, where we just stay completely the same? There's just no evolution in thought, technology, art. Nothing happens. And so we are now towards the end of the two hundred and fifty year millennial reign, which is why all this evil is getting exposed, and the inversion is becoming so apparent to us because Satan's little season is coming to a close and this So this year would be the end?
46:00Pretty yeah. Pretty much like it's Like literally, yes. It's two hundred fifty years since then, and so there's some buffering and doesn't actually happen like at but but yeah. In this I've never heard any of this. Oh, it's it's really interesting. It's really, really rich. And when you combine it with some of these like modern architectural analysis that's going on, the possibility of a mud flood, how so many of these significant buildings,
46:26the basements are actually normal stories of windows that that were buried under a mud flood. Yeah. Like, there's there's some real evidence that this shit was completely real. The changing of our calendar from a thirteen month, twenty eight day. Like, our calendar makes no sense. Like, November. You know? Nine months
46:46is actually the eleventh month of the year. December 10 is the twelfth month of the year. Sept,
46:54seven is the '9 you know, the ninth month of the year that everything's been inverted, oct. You know? October is should be '9. It's the tenth. You know? It's like, October should be '8, and it's the tenth. Everything's been inverted. And if you look at our calendar with the jumbling of twenty eight days, thirty days, thirty one days, there's it works out perfectly to twenty eight days that have been inserted into the calendar. So we naturally should have had a thirteen month calendar.
47:21Every Monday starts the same, you know, holidays, worship, timing of crops and harvesting seasons,
47:29everything was menstruation. Everything was completely organized. With thirteen months. With twenty eight months. You have twenty eight days. Okay. So everything in this realm has been inverted, that we're living in this inversion.
47:42Which if you think about like corruption gets rewarded, it's inversion, you know. I just saw a new thing from Florida where Epstein seemed to be driving in a brand new big convertible BMW. Somebody pulled up next to him, and they're like, what the fuck? Which would make perfect sense because he was in Israel before, and Israel's getting bombed now. So now, you know, you know, he would be in Florida. He's headed back to Tampa. Yeah. He's headed back to back to Florida.
48:06What insights have you What is this calendar thing? Is it called the is it a Gregorian? The Gregorian calendar, which supposedly like in the year 1345, Pope Gregory
48:19basically needed to find a way to disorient the pagan organization of the world, insert the Roman Catholicism,
48:27which was basically just a mechanism so the ancient families of Rome could find a new way to lord and rule over the world, you know, which is goes back to the 13 ruling families and like the kind of deep, deeper conspiracy,
48:42which I don't think is any real area of your expertise, we should kind of what what I kind of want to drive at is like like, so you've done all this traditional brain work, all this traditional academic study, all this outside of academic channel study, all this business and life experience, now coaching experience, and now you've added these deep, deep psychedelic explorations where you're a leader in the field of kind of psychedelic research and personal experimentation,
49:06like what the fuck is going on? Where the fuck are we? What instrument In reality? What have you Even if it's just, I know, I don't know, what are some insights and revelations that you've kind of had as you've moved from traditional course of study into this now
49:24area of psychedelic expertise? Every single thing that I've ever seen in quantum mechanics, science, every lesson I've ever learned on a journey, and every lesson I've ever even heard about
49:37or or even that exists in research that people learn on on like these deep psychedelic experiences goes back to the the seven hermetic principles. And every time there's a breakthrough
49:51Can you can you just do them real quick for our audience? I don't I don't have them memorized. Just The first two are the most important though. The first one is all is mind. The universe is mental.
50:04Law number two is the law of correspondence. This is as above so below. Mhmm. Oh, yeah. So here's my spiel, and I and I'm not married to this idea, and I don't I don't subscribe to any one idea. I just think it's very interesting. That if you're in a dream right now,
50:23and you're let's say you're dreaming that you're in this room, the distance from you to that fireplace is probably 17 feet. Right?
50:32But what is the distance in your and in the dream, you're looking through your eyes, but the eyes that you're seeing with in the dream do not exist. But why can't you make a decision to see out of your stomach in your dream?
50:49You force yourself to look out of your eyes. And also as a fun fact, nobody dreams about cell phones. Nobody
50:59ever. Wait. Oh, yeah. Wait. Let That's a whole another theory. Let's let's pin in that one because I wanna come back to that. Let's come back to that.
51:11Alright. So you're in the dream. The distance from you to this fireplace, 14 feet, but in the dream, this distance is made out of what?
51:22What is the material that makes up this distance between you and the fireplace in real life? If you're looking in reality, there is no distance. Right? So the fireplace is not real, but what about the the you that's looking at the fireplace in the dream?
51:39Also not real. Right. But what is this fireplace made out of if you're dreaming? It's made out of you.
51:47Everything is recursive back to some point of consciousness. Does this make sense so far? Yeah. So there is no such thing as distance in a dream because everything that I'm looking at in the dream is made out of chase. Mhmm. This is all me. So the all is mind in the dream.
52:05Does this make sense so far? Mhmm. And if anyone's ever into lucid dreaming or trying to get into lucid dreaming, it's like you can explore consciousness that way big time. And there's a there's a supplement called galantamine,
52:19which is all also a prescription Alzheimer's drug, which is like 100% guaranteed lucid dreaming. The one piece of advice I would give people if you're trying to go into lucid dreaming is do not use the toilets. They don't work
52:35because you'll piss the bed. Oh, that's interesting. Don't use the toilets in a lucid dream.
52:45Okay. So let's say we're in that dream space. The separation is an illusion
52:52in the dream. So the separation between me and this microphone is just something that's fabricated through consciousness because that's me.
53:02If I'm dreaming right now, this is me. You're me. You're me. The separation is an illusion. So when we say as above, so below, what if we took that dream world, an individual dreaming,
53:15and then took it up to a collective dream? So what if that's just a a layer below, and this is just the next layer of it? So just the thought that there are
53:29doors here, and tables, and carpet, and all this stuff might just be consciousness, and that is like the most modern discoveries in quantum mechanics and quantum neuropsychology are starting to prove that our brains are quantum.
53:45Like, one third of the atoms or particles inside of our brain are gone at any given time, like 24 a day. One third of them are existing in some other place.
53:56And then what about the material realm? Because you have hands in your dream, but the hand doesn't exist. But in the dream you can touch it. You can squeeze it. You can test it. You can taste it. You can smell it. Everything is provably real inside of a dream.
54:15So what if this is just level or we're on the 2nd Floor? So it's just a dream within a dream. Yeah. Yeah. And I don't a 100% subscribe to that there. I just think it's just mind blowing Right. All by itself. Right.
54:32It's a harder one to get to. By the way, I do have the other hermetic principles, which I I do love as well. I think the three is polarity. Right? Or In no particular order, but Polarity, opposites are two ends of the same spectrum, hot cold,
54:49love hate. Vibration, everything is in motion and constantly constantly vibrating. The one that
54:57I think really helps me is the law of rhythm, which everything moves in cycles and flows. And so when things are going great, like just not subscribing too much to how great things are because
55:11they need to come back down to the ebb. Yeah. You know? And when conversely, when things are feeling really shitty, it's like
55:21this too shall pass. And just like knowing that this kind of
55:28orientation needs to complete its cycle much like the hero's journey, and just like trusting, staying in it for me has been super helpful. And then cause and effect, nothing happens by chance. Every action creates a result.
55:44And then gender, masculine and feminine principles exist in all things and drive creation. But yeah, everything Which when you think about that in terms of the inversion and how hard they work to confuse that hermetic principle. Yeah. That's Satan's little season right there, to invert and confuse everything. Well, the beginning lie that you have to sell to everyone to really psyop the entire world,
56:10it has to start with separation. That has to be step one. Like, if you're doing something evil, separation has to be step one. If I want you to hate you, I have to convince you that that's not you.
56:24Right? Because if I view everything as one, like if we are all not connected, but if we're all one, I don't need morality anymore. I don't I don't have morals. I'm just protecting me. Right. I'm doing good for other people because that's me. There's no morality there,
56:43but here's the here's the biggest one. If we can go on a little deepened tangent. Please. A little deeper than before. This is another one from Alan Watts, but he said if you were suppose you're God, and you can dream, you can experiment, and do all these experiments,
56:59you're going to have trillions and trillions of years worth of dreams, and eventually you're to be like, yeah, this sucks. I need to add some dragons or some cliffs and like somebody trying to stab me and stuff like that. It doesn't mean anything unless there's some stakes. So then you do that for another trillion years, but you you still know that you're God, and you still was like, oh, yeah. Fuck you, dragon. Like, you know, he cut his head off or whatever.
57:25He said it it just going along with this thought experiment, no matter what, eventually you will reach a point where the only way to enjoy anything is to ,
57:39and you have to forget. It's the only way to make anything meaningful, and man, that hit me in the chest when I heard it for the first time.
57:49You're gonna I mean, no matter what, you'll reach a point where you don't want to know that because everything's meaningless, and it's hard to have any stakes. You can't have stakes if you're God.
58:03I know that one, the exact one you're talking about, and I think a buddy of mine, Baretta, did a musical accompaniment to that one, which I'll I'll see if I can find it and have Lindsay post it Yeah. In the in the show notes. But it is like I remember when I heard it, I was like, what the fuck? It's like to convince you that you aren't God. And it's like, holy shit. Because you would end up in this particular dream
58:31out of all the dreams, and it's like, holy shit. Yeah. What a cool dream. Mhmm. Yeah. So I mean, in all the all the research that they're doing, they're finding
58:45too much of the research right now is just materialist reductionism. Like, if if we have an orchestra, I will never begin to understand music by dissecting a cello. Could spend five thousand years dissecting sheet music and cello and put it under a microscope. It doesn't do anything. It doesn't help me understand music at all, and that's what science does. It's reduce it down to every single material element,
59:12strip it into a million pieces, and stick each one under a microscope and study it. But I think there's something that's immaterial that we just don't understand yet. We're a baby species. We haven't been here very long.
59:26Have you heard the theory that we're not from Earth? Have you heard this? Yes. In multiple different forms. So Like Anunnaki Yeah.
59:38Impregnated our ancestors or something? Yeah. So the Anunnaki are the fallen angels, and 200 of them were cast out of heaven. And
59:48well, first they were put here as the watchers to protect God's sacred realm. And then they saw like, oh, there's some pretty good looking women here, and, you know, so I wanna so they started having sex with the humans of God's creation and then created the Nephilim, which were half human, half fallen angels. And that's where these like 13 families that supposedly rule the world, they're still the direct
60:14Nephilim. So there's a really good there's a really podcast I like that I've been on called Nephilim Death Squad where they go into all this shit all the time. And they're always like, yeah, it's just Nephilim shit. Like, all the stuff that we're dealing with is just these fucking egoic fallen angels who separated themselves from God and impregnated
60:31human women, created this kind of subspecies. It's all just this elitist subspecies group having these battles for supremacy where sometimes they work together and sometimes they're fighting against each other. It's all very fatiguing at this point. Like, I would like to have a time out. I'm really just you know, I have children, and I have, like, mundane things I'd like to see for them. Like my both my kids are very good athletes, you know. Like they love their sport. I love watching their sport. Like the thing I can imagine you sitting there at like a football
61:03game or soccer game, your kids playing, all the parents are watching their kids, and inside your brain you're going like, what if there were ancient reptiles and they mated with humans in the DNA? And like you're going through all this shit in your head. So dude, you have no idea. It affects me so much. First off, I'm a great parent in terms of like love, attentiveness,
61:21you know, food. My wife and I do an incredible job. I am so bad with like discipline and work ethic because I'm like, oh, fuck. Go. Fine. I'll do the dishes. Go hang out with your friends. You know? Okay. Don't do the chore. I'll do it. Because like, know, it's like poof. It's all gonna be gone, you know, in a second. So like, it really this this level of nihilism that's in fact affected our world really affects my parenting in terms of like discipline. And I'm raising kids that like they have really good like sport work ethics, but like if I ask them to do I have this thing called the three to one ratio.
61:54Like if I ask my kids to do something, there is a three x complaining to the one x of the task. So I have ninety seconds of fighting for thirty seconds of putting dishes away.
62:06So it's You're describing my life too. Yes. So but basically, I'm so concerned that this is this this illusion, which has brought me like a lot of joy and children, and I got to get 19 tackles against Ohio State in one moment of my life. You know? It's like I want my kids to have those tastes. So I don't I'm terrible with the discipline. It totally influences like our home. At Taco, sure. Spend okay. It's fine. Go do it. It's alright.
62:32I'm the same way. Are you that way too? Yeah. I I've shifted a little bit because it's been I think required, but but I had a similar kind of orientation like But drinking coffee. They'll figure it out when they need to. I mean, they they are brought up in a completely different world, in a completely different level of
62:53prosperity than I grew up in, and that really served me like it did each of us here. And they don't have the same,
63:06yeah, the same suite of options available to them. They're much different. Some would argue much better. I don't know. They didn't choose that well, maybe they did choose. I mean, we could argue about that if they chose to come in as our kids, but you know I have a lot of empathy for them because
63:26growing up with with more resources doesn't make your life better. And and they've expressed that to me recently like people just not understanding,
63:38thinking that they grew up in this really nice house and the like, that it doesn't mean that their life is easier. In some ways it's more challenging because they don't have the natural obstacles that we had. And their path
63:53ahead of them is is much more obscured, particularly now with yeah. AI and And it's got to be more self defined for the kids. Like for us it was easier in a way like, you know,
64:07do you want do you want to live in the same level of struggle that your parents did, and or do you want to get out of this small town in Maine? Like it was a lot more like, oh, I want to get out of the small town in Maine, so I'm going to do well in school. I'm going to kick ass in hockey. I'm going to get into this school, and then I get this opportunity, you know, with commodity trading, and I'm gonna completely go for it because I don't wanna live in this tiny little fucking town. But all of a sudden, you're living in Austin, and you're like, it's a great house, and a great home, and a great mom, and a great dad, and you're like, oh, fuck. Like, you know, how you define ambition. You know? I talk to my kids directly about that.
64:39I'm like, you know, like, a young person, you have to have some level of healthy ambition to propel your life forward. Yeah. And I think, like, the one thing I really, really hammered down on my kids, like, you can have shitty grades every once in a while. You could do all that kind of stuff. I don't care that much.
64:59It's just like, just look around at everybody the more connected somebody is online, the more you have loneliness, anxiety, depression Mhmm. Crazy amounts of stuff. It's like living in a big city like this almost guarantees
65:14loneliness and depression. And it's like if you just look at the people who are happier, who live longer, have less heart disease, less fill in the blank, less. They're socially connected. They know who their neighbors are. They they talk to people in three dimensions a lot more. And I mean, I don't remember the town, but and they were still smoked cigarettes and stuff every day. It's not like they were like vegans and had this crazy weird diet or anything. It's just that they were connected
65:41to nature because we are nature. We are we're not like, I need to go outside and spend time in nature. It's like, that's me out there. And like the further you get, you get into these cities, it's like a little factory for apathy, and depression, and anxiety, and all that stuff. Mhmm. Loneliness.
66:00Mhmm. Rampant loneliness. Yeah. And then the more resources you have, the less you're seeking out your neighbors for support so that you're all pitching in together. It's like, oh, I'm self reliant, and then that just becomes more isolating. I know that for me personally, this idea of being self reliant, was amazing for me as you were saying, like coming up,
66:22you know, in Winthrop, Maine and Yeah. Like knowing that I needed to rely on myself as I became much older and I still had such an identification with that,
66:33it was just creating more distance with me and my wife because I wasn't seeking out her support because I really felt like I needed to do it on my own, and that was just,
66:46you know, as I've let go of that and and reached out to her and tried to find ways for us to connect in that way, we're more of a partnership now. That is beautiful, and I'm glad.
67:00This goes back to just everything that we've been talking about is it's the archetype. You get you start using, like, I need a big house. I need to go to the country club. I need to go to all these things. You're fulfilling an archetype,
67:15and that's all you're really doing. And you're just kind of trying to do a Spielberg story, and we're not really creating like, what are the things that get I can get real value from? And I made a YouTube video like a year ago called Earth is a video game.
67:32I think that's the name of it. But I basically I made a tutorial and a a review of of this planet as if it were a video game,
67:43and just kind of like, here are the things you need to do to win. Like, if you want to figure out like how to win at life, look at the regrets of dying people. There is no better teacher than than looking at the regrets of people that are dying. I wish I had spent more time with family. I wish I'd have paid more attention to my friends. I wish I'd have checked in with people more often. I wish I read more books. I wish I it's never about anything else than like the real shit that that really fulfills us,
68:10And it's very simple. There's not some secret method to happiness. Just look at the , and you will see the code to life. I don't know whether I spoke to you about I think I might have mentioned this last time. I don't know. We're like an old married couple now. We get together. We talk about the same shit. So I have this theory that mushrooms
68:29work on the vertical axis. So it's the it's the the Earth's kind of geomorphic, sublime, divine energy
68:39compressed into this fungus. You ingest the fungus, and then it opens you up to the divine. And it works from the divine through you to the earth Yeah. The earth through you to the divine. And it's opening up that corridor. So basically on this earth plane, you can live healthier, happier, a more productive, enjoyable, meaningful life. And that the other psychedelics,
69:00DMT and so forth, work on a horizontal plane. And it's a little more precarious when you're in the horizontal horizontal plane because other shit from dimensions and timelines can kind of jump in. Having done a wealth of both, what do you think of that theory, and have you had any experiences to kind of validate or invalidate?
69:22I was the forty first person in the world to do intravenous DMT for five hours. Five hours. Just for our audience to know Actually, that was you were about to do it when we sat here last. Yeah. Yeah. And so I I would love to have you share about that experience
69:41well. For reference, most d m other DMT, they can be a long time in the dimensions you go into, but they're really just about twenty minutes a DMT experience. Yeah. I think the average is eight. Eight. Okay. So you went in for five hours. Yeah. What could go wrong?
69:58So I mean, just for the record, I went in for neuroplasticity. Yeah. I got the results of a brain scan and and like 38% of my brain is not even working to the point where I shouldn't really be able to function very well, and I and I'm fine. I'm better than I've been in my better than I was in my twenties now.
70:20And I I wanted the neurogenesis, which means, like, when when you're on a psychedelic, neurogenesis means that your brain is getting this
70:32boost of a chemical called BDNF, brain derived nootrophic factor, and the BDNF helps new little babies baby neurons get made, which are like 99% of them, 95% of them are in the hippocampus
70:46area that we know of only. And it also enables this other thing called LTP,
70:55long term potentiation, which means that your neurons can get a divorce when they need to, which is long term depotentiation, and they can get married to ones that they need to. So like if you have a damaged area of your brain here,
71:09this what's called it's neuroplasticity, but there's a subtype of neuroplasticity called synaptic plasticity where the synapses
71:19can get a divorce, and then like, hey, these guys used to talk to each other. We're gonna wrap around this damaged area, and we're gonna we're gonna form a new network around damage. So I was really trying to do that, but the journey itself, oh my god, five hours
71:35of just being ripped out of this entire reality. It's kind of like you get a like you're , and like you can see all of this, and it and it's
71:49you can it's more real than reality. It's a thousand times more real than this than this ever can or could hope to be, and it kind of ruins you in a little bit in a good way where when you come back, you know, like, this looks like a cartoon oil painting when you come back from something on DMT. Do you recall, like, any specifics, like nuggets, moments you can kind of share? Yeah. So
72:17the the first one, it it was intravenous. So I had it I had it in my arm. I was laying down. These people held the space so beautifully well, and they had a beautiful space for it. And that first moment
72:30because when you do DMT, everyone goes to this place called the waiting room, which you're familiar with probably. I've heard of it. I've actually just the one of probably the only real psychedelic I haven't done. I've done five MEO, but never DMT. Okay. It's heavy. I mean, the way that Kevin described it, he was the guy who who facilitated our experience.
72:51He described he had the best word to describe DMT that I've ever heard in my life. He just said, . It's big in a way that you cannot fathom, describe, comprehend, imagine, or even come close to understanding how big DMT is,
73:09and that is just the perfect word for me. But the first thing that happened right when I was in there, I buzzed right past the waiting room because the machine is an anesthesiology machine.
73:23So it's basically like a big there's a giant fat syringe full of DMT, and there's a machine that pumps it at a certain milliliters per minute rate. And like if you want to go up, you want like you want to launch, they could just turn the dial and it pump, pump, pump, pump. It'll do a little boost, and you're
73:43you're launched out. So I Obviously did that. Yeah. I spent like three milliseconds in the waiting room, and I was up there instantly, and these beings and for four thousand five hundred years, we've all seen the same exact
73:59same beings up there. Every human without any exception, sees the exact same entities on on DMT for forty five hundred years, which is bizarre. But these things shoved me down onto this like stainless steel kind of medical table,
74:16and from pelvis all the way up to my neck, cut my body open with these massive shears, and it didn't hurt. Like there was no pain, and I I wasn't scared at all. Like if it happened in this life,
74:30yeah, it it would be terrifying. But on the DMT space, everything's okay. Like, it's full of love and non judgment and all that stuff, and they're weird looking light beings that kind of look like they're aliens, but I could hear them
74:47every single sound. I could hear my organs kind of sloshing as they pushed their hands. I could feel every single thing that they were doing to me, and it was just imagine it's 10,000 more more more real than this, and and I was going through this. And then this other Can I ask you a question? So are you are you here looking at them, or are you also here looking at them, and then also
75:13completely objectified where you're looking at it? No. It was in my head. Okay. So you're in the subjective? Yes. You're looking at this as First we person. See Yes. Okay. So I'm kind of laid down on this table looking up, and then this one holds my forehead down and sticks a like a drill bit like this long into my nose. It's freezing cold,
75:37and it goes up into my nose, and I could feel it going further and further and further all the way until it bumps the back of my skull, and the drill bit is it doesn't go through my skull, but it's pushing my head down onto the table where I can't pick my head up, and it is ice cold, and there's no pain, but then I could feel like stuff moving inside of my head, like something come come out of this drill bit. I don't know. Stuff was going on.
76:05And then all kinds of other shit happened for five hours that never stopped. Well, I took a pee break. So during the experience, like, if you need to pee or something or if you want to come down a little bit, they can kind of just adjust your altitude right there on that little machine, which is unbelievable. But then I'm done with the whole experience. I go back to the hotel,
76:26and then I find out the night before we were at their house just to kind of I'm gonna look at the space. I'm gonna we're gonna talk to them. They're the nicest people. They do this at their home in in Denver,
76:39and I didn't know this, but this guy, he's a genetic scientist. He's a genetic science research expert who makes the the medicine, But he took Michelle, my wife, into the kitchen
76:54and into the freezer and showed her this little pelican box of vials so she could select the vials that I would use the next day. And they prayed over these vials,
77:07and right after I told her everything, she said the only prayer that I said was for them to immediately fix your heart and then your head, because I have a I have a heart thing going on as well, and I have a brain disease.
77:22And she told the DMT to do that the night before. Wow. That was a question I was gonna ask. Wow. And Then that was the first order of business that they that they had. They just went straight to it. Yeah. And
77:36And I didn't know. I never knew that she even went in the kitchen. Like, I just thought they were up bullshitting somewhere in the house. Wow. And how have you been since? Yeah. What was it like? Because because I know we were in touch right after that, and it was like kind of putting the pieces back together was was kind of first order of business.
77:56Yeah. It it started off with a depression. And I remember I'm laying there on this thing. I'm in this experience. Like, alright, Chase. We're gonna we're gonna go ahead and bring you start bringing you down, and
78:13the unwillingness that I had to come back here was monumental. Like, I I
78:19just please kill me. Like, didn't say that, but I did say I have a tape of the entire thing. Videoed it. Coming down, I did ask 39 times throughout that whole experience if I was dead.
78:34Like, out loud, I'm like, am I dead? 39 times. That's how deep it was. Like, I didn't know if I still had a body or if I was dead. I had no clue. It was really deep, and coming down, it felt like there is absolutely
78:51zero way for me to return back to this life without developing some narcissism. Mhmm.
79:02And that's that's what was really depressing to me, that I had that I had to go back and like develop a little just to survive, just to live on this planet. You had to have some narcissism, and I was I was crying so
79:17fucking hard, man. And these God bless these people wiping my tears and snot coming out of my nose.
79:25But it was like I did not really want to come back.
79:29It it's kind of like if if randomly someone like you feel a weird thing on your head. You don't know what it is. There's nobody in the house. You feel this thing moving on your head, and all of a sudden you're in another reality, and someone just took off a VR helmet, and this is where you've been the whole time. You're just inside of a little VR game.
79:49And then like you go to like actual reality where there's just unlimited love and peace and abundance, and they're like, okay. We gotta put the helmet back on. You've gotta go back inside the the video game. Fuck. That's what it felt like, man. And just kind of integrating after five hours of that was really, really tough for probably a couple weeks. How
80:11two questions. Five hours of our earth plane linear time was about how long in the DMT world, if you have any sense of that? It was six months.
80:24Five or six months is what it felt like. Did you have like a you had a whole life and little world happening up there? Yeah. But it wasn't like
80:36it wasn't me Yeah. Per se. It was just kind of I was with other things happening, and I could kind of observe things happening and talk to these creatures and stuff and these these entities. But it's like
80:52like we're we're these little infantile hairless monkeys, like our our little species. It's so funny.
81:01And then we're like, you know what? You know what I wanna learn today? I'm gonna learn the secrets of the universe. And and then you do DMT, and they're like, alright, motherfucker. And they show it all to you and you can't comprehend it. You can't understand it. You'll never be able to piece any of it together and try explaining one billionth of 1% of it to another human being. Good luck. But they still show it to you. And it's like you're not bringing it back. You're not going to carry it with you back when you come back here.
81:31We are doing some experimentation with mixing high doses of Alzheimer's drugs with the DMT Mhmm. So that we can bring back much bigger chunks of data and and and information there. And doc there's a guy named Andrew Gallimore. Mhmm. And he's doing a whole lot of research with this. This beautiful
81:50brain this guy has Trying to map out, not a physical map, but trying to understand and develop a knowledge of this hyperspace,
82:01whatever the place is that we go on the DMT. How about the how about the biological and and neurological surgery that they did or work on you? How's how's your heart and your brain been since
82:14you had the procedures done? Zero problems with anything Wow. Since then. Wow. And I haven't got a brain scan because the scan that I have to get is called a PET. So PET stands for positron emission tomography, but it's it's nuclear.
82:30So the scan is so bad that I can't hug my wife or sleep in the same bed as them for forty eight hours because there's so much nuclear radiation coming out of my body. So I just I'll I'll treat it as if like I know I have a brain problem when I have symptoms. I don't need a machine. Yeah. Like, have these friends that wear these like 15 Aura rings and sleep monitors and all this kind of shit. I'm like, dude, you have
82:56eight sensors in this thing, and you have 9,000,000 in your body. Like your body's way more advanced than your Apple Watch. Right. It knows exactly whether or not you wake up in the morning and feel like, shit, you didn't sleep well. Right. Like I don't need an Apple Watch. Like your body has billions and billions of sensors and and data collection mechanisms
83:19to tell you when things are off, and its natural response is to heal itself. So you're just the only thing that your body needs is material, raw materials. It just needs that stuff, and there's so many times people go to a psychologist
83:33or people go to a psychologist, and then fifteen years later discover this whole time they've had a vitamin b twelve deficiency,
83:42or they have some physiological problem that's causing psychological issues. Yeah. A lot of research on that. Minerals, it's almost like a one hundredth of correlation between depression and mineral deficiency imbalances in the brain and so forth. Yeah. So how about like your aura, your energy, your frequency, your vibration? Are you finding
84:02like synergies, kismet, serendipities, coincidences now more? Are you without being like narcissistic about it, like, are you a more like positive and ultimately like uplifting energy and presence and for you, your family, your colleagues, your students, and so forth? I've gotten a lot better as a human being. Mhmm.
84:22Because I think with every not microdose, but every I mean, I'm on a microdose right now. But I mean, like, every journey that I've ever done has helped me to understand
84:35with each thing I'm less special than I thought I was. I'm less special than I thought I was. I'm in a beautiful amazing way, not some self demeaning way. Yeah. In a freeing way, and it's just less and less special. And starting out, I thought I was really special. Big
84:56time. And then the the mushrooms have a way of exactly what we talked about earlier, shifting that perspective so much and zooming you out to show you how small you are. How small and important you are. Special versus important. You know? Like, I think they're different things. Mhmm.
85:15And I think the the more that I can be shown how not special I am, the better my life gets. And along the lines of, you know, adding the the Alzheimer's
85:28drug as a, you know, to go along with the the DMT, are there other areas that you're looking to explore? Would you go back into that five hour experience? Where do you kind of sit with that as your kind of next frontier?
85:45I'm definitely going back.
85:49Y'all should come. And I'll I'll if if either of you guys wanna do it, I'll sit with you the whole time, and I'll sit there and hold your hand the whole time. It's an amazing I mean, it it will permanently change you in in that when you come back here for the rest of your life,
86:10no matter what, no matter how seductive the world is, the rest of your life, you're gonna know that it's fake.
86:16Yeah. I'm super curious. I know you're a hard no, I'm sure. No. Don't know you. No. No. I'm not a Well, you're terrified of doing the big journeys and stuff. So I'm curious. It's heavy. It's heavy. But it's definitely it's not it's not it's Not a judgment either. No. But there's there's a really nice hold on. Kyle Kingsbury. Godsbury. I forgot Godsley's first name. Eric Godsley. Eric Godsley. So Eric Godsley has this expression called the death cookie.
86:44So like whenever you're shown something that you really don't want to do, you got to eat it. You got to eat that death cookie. So I'm so aware of like the death cookies. I'm like, oh, no. I I should do it. I want to do it. Yeah. But I'm I'm terrified of it. I think in the good and kind of, you know, a respectful way. Well, there's there's there's a balance of terrified.
87:05Sometimes terrified could be that's a signal like not yet. I think having a healthy like, fear is the right word, but like, okay, this is a big experience, whether It's it's a death in a way. Yeah. Yeah. But I'm also like very curious and and
87:24would love to And Terrence McKenna had the best phrase for it I've ever heard in my life, and he called it . Mhmm. Which just perfectly encapsulates that entire experience. It's like it's so astonishing
87:40in a way that you will never ever be able to describe this to another person, and that's gonna piss you off. Like, it pisses me off that I can't like I can't convey what happens on DMT to another person. Mhmm. And it's it's a chemical that we make in our own body Yeah. And it's a felony
87:59in almost the entire country. We make it in our body, and it's a felony. Yeah. We'll talk about the clown world inversion that we live in, know, . Let's infer everything. You know what I mean? Oh, yeah. My wife and I have to drive past three vape stores and two liquor stores to go pick up our illegal raw milk.
88:21Right. Right. Which has to be also labeled not for human consumption. Right. Right.
88:30No. That's as a big raw milk person, it's crazy. Here in Texas, they changed the law, and
88:39they like, they can't sell it anymore, but you have to buy it as like a gift card. It's like a whole weird thing. So you can't you can't just go to the market and buy it. Some farmers kind of just don't pay any attention to it because the enforcement is slack, but technically, like, you have to order in advance as like a gift card. It's like a weird kind of loophole.
89:01Wow. In Virginia, you have to own a piece of the cow. So, like, several families will own a part of a cow or a part ownership in a cow. And if because the Virginia law is if you own the cow, you can no one can tell you that you can't drink milk out of your own cow. So so technically
89:22when I go to pick up raw milk, it's from my cow that I own, and that's what I'm taking home. That's a great workaround right there. Yeah. What about you, chef? Like, what have you been working on? I know obviously the Max Deck came out at the kind of end of the year. Can we talk about this Max Deck? I'd love to. I take this every day now. You do? So you sent me a freebie Yeah. Bag,
89:46and it took me like a month to get to it, and I because you texted me every week, did you try the Max Tech yet? But now I do it every day. So this is like I have a little lineup. I have a rolling like, cart. Pharmacopoeia? Yeah. That's has my daily stuff on it, so I can kind of bring it if I need to pull it in my office or whatever.
90:05And MaxSac is like the far left, and I go from left to right on this cart every day. There's MaxSac, creatine, and then other stuff, iodine. Mhmm. But this MaxSac, can you talk about what's in it? Because just looking at the ingredients list is overwhelming to me. So what we wanted to do with the MaxStax MaxStax does not have our secret ingredient in it, so it's non psychoactive. It has no psilocybin,
90:30which we call for obvious purposes the Brain Supreme mushroom blend or active ingredient. So what we wanted to do with Macstack is we spent years researching by almost I mean, with mushrooms, there's so many things that complement mushrooms at the psychedelic level. You know? It's like basically just love and thinking good thoughts complement, you know, your mushroom dose. But there are certain ingredients that definitely can complement and boost a micro and a macro dose. So we wanted to create a product that basically
90:57we threw the kitchen sink at from a therapeutic and and ritual standpoint, also like an everyday usage. So we basically wanted to add every known ingredient in the world that benefits a micro and a macro dose. So mushrooms,
91:10adaptogens, aminos, and cacao. So we created a base of ceremonial cacao and ceylon cinnamon, and then we have 22 other ingredients,
91:20chaga, reishi, cordyceps, lion's mane, and then we've got about 10 different minerals and adaptogens, and then 10 different amino acids and creatine in this base of very high grade ceremonial cacao and Ceylon cinnamon. Now it has to be Ceylon cinnamon because at high doses regular cinnamon is is deleterious for the kidney. It's not so good. Ceylon cinnamon, the true cinnamon, you can take that five grams, ten grams at a time. But other cinnamons, you don't want to you don't want to do that with. They're it's a different type of bark for a different type of cinnamon tree. Only the Ceylon cinnamon is is healthy at high doses. So
91:54it's a little bitter. I tell everybody that because we want them to leave it unsweetened. I do it in my so I do like, for me, the new founders thing is the which is what you did this morning is the Mac Stack with the black stack. So it's a three hundred milligram microdose with the Mac Stack and, like energy focus. So I make a Mac Stack latte. I actually just throw everything in the blender, and then I just pour it through a strainer. So I do I do some coffee, which now I do less coffee, and I do a half calf, half decaf,
92:22and then I throw in the Mac Stack. I'll actually add a little more cinnamon, a little creatine, local raw honey, pour the hot water, blend that up for like forty five seconds, then I pour in like some raw milk or some organic heavy cream, and then just pour that through a strainer. So after about three hours, you're ready to go. It takes about three hours to make that drink? Jesus. No. Honestly, in the blender it's fast. It's because if you did in a French press separately and made the French press, it's if you just go in the blender with your ground coffin and pour it through a strainer Yeah. It's forty five seconds. You know, you can let it sit there, pour it through, and then and then you're set. But in terms of like, if you thought if you compared that with opening up let's say you took one third of the supplements that are in MaxStaq. Like even from a time standpoint, I think the making of the MaxStax is still faster than if you opened up seven different supplement jars.
93:12So probably saving you time. Yeah. I mean, traditionally people would like make their coffee and then add this. Yeah. Just or just make your coffee and just stir the MaxStax in. And then with all the with all the amino acids and minerals, there's a little bitterness there. It's kind of like a coffee like bitterness. Some people really like that. I add a little bit of of local raw honey or some maple crystals or some kind of hippie sugar in some way.
93:36But yeah, that was our idea that we wanted. And I've used it ceremonial now too, which is really great. Like I've put four grams in it, blended it up because we wanted to test it that way. Wow. And it was was deep. Yeah. And it's also it was it was interesting because the journey
93:53like it was it was the the the ascent is a little faster, the journey's great, and the descent is a little faster. So you're in and you're out a little quicker. And the journey is interesting because there's like a nutritional sustenance in the journey. So like hunger pangs or other things that can kind of sometimes mess with you were just totally satiated.
94:13So it's like a really wonderful four hour Dude. Ride. That's awesome. Yeah. You know what I wound up doing? The creatine that I take every day is like Walgreens brand. No. No. You got to get the stuff with the German approval, the creatine monohydrate. It is creatine monohydrate. Yeah. But there's like
94:31honestly, I've asked a couple people about that. I'm not sure. Something about there's a German patent on creatine that it's like a little Sean Wells would be the one to answer. I get a brand called Momentous. It's really clean creatine. But what I wound up doing is I'd take that little tub of creatine and I would dump it in this bag Yeah. And mix it up. Yeah. So that every day I'm not having to do two different things. I'm trying to like minimize this Yeah. Yeah. This thing I do in the morning. Yeah. Yeah. Because we're we're at one gram or it depends if you do one scoop or two scoops worth, five hundred or one gram of creatine,
95:04and probably you want to be around five to maybe 10 grams of creatine, so you can certainly add more creatine. Yeah. I dumped it in there, and I don't keep it in this bag. Like the bag is beautiful though. I have a, like, a glass cylinder thing that I take it out of, and every day I'll kind of roll it on its side and then give it a couple of back and forths and then scoop out of it. Yeah. You get your technique down. I have a lot of athletes who are doing the max so
95:30particularly for like morning athletics where you don't want to eat. So let's say like you got a pickleball or you got your workout and you don't want to necessarily eat before your workout. I have some professional athletes and amateur athletes. They'll do the max stack with their microdose.
95:47If you can time it out like sixty to seventy five minutes before kickoff or main game time, you're gonna hit flow state to combine a microdose with max stack before your morning workout, like an hour or so. It's flow state workouts. Wow. I get a lot of feedback from athletes and just gym guys and everything. They take I just saw a guy yesterday who's a, you know, 55 year old dude now who was a bodybuilder, still likes to train R. He's like, dude, they gotta pull me out of the gym on athlete. I time it out like an hour before, and the workouts are just great. You actually gave these to me. So
96:21could you give me a like walk me through what each one of these are. Okay. So black stacks are extra strength. So we take a three hundred milligram microdose, and we blend it with nano curcumin, ginger,
96:33and vitamin c. So it's our it's our extra strength, triple strength. Three hundred milligrams can be a lot for some people with a microdose. For me, it's kind of a sweet spot. And so that that's our extra strength formula. You know, you can we don't we really created Brain Supreme as a micro dosing supplement, but you can tune up and take a couple black stacks and hit a little cruising altitude. If you're going do anything more than that, think you should work with just straight mushrooms and so forth. Yeah.
96:59HOOKBut you know, if you've got an off day on a weekend and it's in a responsible setting, you can take three or four of them, you know, just kind of go for a little bit of a marvel at the Central Texas clouds for a couple hours. But that's our extra strength formula. So and that actually, in terms of cost per most expensive ingredient, that has nine grams total active ingredient because it's thirty capsules at three hundred milligrams, which is nine grams. Every other product is six grams. Every other product has more complementary ingredients, but the the cost by most expensive ingredients so black stack, if you can handle three hundred milligram microdose,
97:30HOOKit's kind of the most cost effective product as well. And then our flagship formula is Genius. That's our most nootropic formula. So it's kind of classic nootropics,
97:42HOOKL theanine, L tyrosine, Alpha GPC, green tea extract, guarana blended with a hundred milligrams of our active ingredient. And then Feel Good is our kind of heart oriented formula, heart emotions libido. We have some nano curcumin in there. Sorry. We have some nanoitized CBD in there
98:01HOOKand Damion, another kind of heart emotion mood. I like actually I take Feel Good the least from a micro dosing standpoint, but Feel Good's really kind of five or six capsules on a weekend. It really is a groovy great feeling. It's really fun for a little cruising altitude. Yeah. You do feel loving and just mellow.
98:23HOOKIt's great for lovemaking. It's good for sex. It's like 10% better. It's like more meaningful and just like you know, touch and and sensations and so forth. It's good. And then athlete is our workout formula. So we blend that with it's a hundred milligrams of the proprietary mushroom that we blend with,
98:41HOOKthen different elements for recovery and heart rate and cardiovascular support and so forth. Stacking athlete and genius is a really good formula as well too. If you're like a if you're a workout person, what we call our performance protocol,
98:55HOOKwhich is in in every other day or one day on, two day off, slightly higher microdose, you can stack athlete and genius about an hour or seventy five minutes before your game or workout. My professional athletes will do practice day and game day because you want to keep it in your system. You never want to be dysregulated for when you want to peak for game day, you do a practice day with a performance dose, and then you save it for game day. So that's a
99:19HOOKreally effective formula for that. And then just kind of mixing it up. The standard protocol is what we call supplement dosing, five days on, two days off, best in the morning, best on an empty stomach, best with a glass of lemon water, or with MaxStax. And then once you figure out like where your sweet spot is, perceptible, non intoxicating, not hallucinatory,
99:37HOOKthen you can start to then you can start to adjust. You know? So start with one capsule, scale up, find your area where you're like, oh, I'm most tuned on. I'm most productive. And then that's your sweet spot, then you can play around. Start with the supplement protocol, really understand these products. Some people like one in the morning, and then they like one at 1PM. Some people if they take it in the afternoon, it's a little sleep disruptive because your brain is still active. Some people are like, you know, I want to feel it more. Like I appreciate a microdose, but I'm going to go to performance dosing because I really want to get tuned up twice a week. Yeah. And then you know, you can you burn off the more noticeable demonstrative sensation in the gym, and then the benefits of the microdose linger throughout the day and the rest of the day and so forth.
100:18HOOKYes, that's what we're doing. But I mean for us the proof's in the pudding because we grow by you know, we grew by 200 from year one to year two, and we grew by another 120% from year two to year three.
100:31HOOKAnd we have the highest conversion rate I believe, of any supplement on all of Shopify's website.
100:40HOOKSo we have a 66% conversion rate from one time buyer to subscriber, which in the supplement space is kind of unheard of. Yeah. So that means that we're we're doing something that's that's working. You are. Yeah. I've been your students have been amazing. You know, they've really they use it as part of the NCI Yeah. Protocol and so forth. Yeah. And nothing that I make them do, but Yep. I know a lot of them
101:04a lot of them love your stuff. You've come in as a guest speaker to our our elite kind of the VIP inner circle of mine. Yeah. It's always fun. And we're amazing people. And I know they were all very appreciative of the education because it's it's one thing to be able to just like, oh, somebody says, oh, I can find I didn't know I could order this. I didn't know it, like, it it could get mailed to my house. It's not labeled
101:29in a way that somebody might get in trouble or anything. And second part is like, okay. Now I can order it, but I need an education. Mhmm. I need a I need a course. I need something, which is why, like, I tell everybody even like the lady that was next to me on the plane on the way over here, I was telling her about this. And I was like, not only can you buy it there, there's a course. And Adam's got a course on brainsubreme.co.
101:53You can take this course. It's going to give you everything that you might need to know about doing microdosing in a healthy way and effective, a way that's actually going to help your life. Great. Well, thanks. I'm actually about to redo the reshoot the whole course too because I finished the home studio. Oh, good. The home we got a little home media and podcasting thing going on now too, so about to redo the whole course as well. Love it. So we'll do version two.
102:14Dude, you're the best, man. It's so great talking to you. And then it's like for Cal and I, it never gets off. We know that you're Cal and I are such good friends now. So it's like when you text, I'm like, okay. Let me tell Cal, because it'd be rather like share the love. Yeah, man. And and I love just like this is I mean, aside from a microphone right here, it just feels like we're we're hanging out. Yeah. I've known you guys for a year or two now, and I've known you for a while now. Two. Yeah. Over two years. And Thank you, Darius. Yeah. And it just feels like we're friends hanging out. Yeah. Yeah. And I love it too because you you texted us yesterday morning, and I was in Las Vegas
102:53getting ready to come back yesterday. And then I was supposed to leave this morning super early for Florida for golf, and I was just, like, on the fence, like, should I change my flight? And then the text came through that you're in town for two days. Do you guys want a podcast Sunday? I'm like, that probably makes the most sense. And then I waited five minutes, I'm like, okay, let's do this, and it worked out perfectly. Yeah. But before we wrap, I do wanna hear
103:19this next project you're you're doing. Yeah. We're I'm building a TV station basically
103:29inside of a building in Virginia, and it's going to be daily news as a daily news channel, except we're going to you know, like the schizophrenic where there's like the red thread that connects everything? Mhmm. We're in a non schizophrenic way, we're gonna show you how everything is actually connected, what's being used as a distraction. Every single piece of the news, every single day, all of the psyops and the manipulation that's happening throughout the media, throughout the
103:57CTAglobal events, the geopolitics that are going on, and then what's being used as a distraction, who's gaining money from this This politician, you know, this thing happened over here, this politician went missing three days right before it happened. We're gonna try to go into like everything, and it's just fact based only. No opinion. No crazy
104:19CTAtheories or anything like that. We'll never take guidance or direction from any marketers or advertisers. We have an open records policy where our entire bank account will be open to the public,
104:32CTAAnd we have a policy that an instant public policy that if any any correspondence or documentation ever asks us to change a narrative or modify something that we're saying, we make it public instantaneously. And that isn't like, even somebody says they have they're sending us a confidential email, it's on our terms of use. Like, if you email us, you agree that that's gonna be made public. Mhmm. So I've tried to make it transparent, but I I wanna make it in a way that's showing you
105:00CTAthe theater. Like, instead of just watching the news, you're like, you'll still get the news every day. We have a news desk, a news anchor, a research team, all that kind of stuff, but we'll also have like, here's the theater part of it. Like, I'm gonna open the back door of the Truman Show a little bit, so you get 10 x the amount that you'll get from any Fox, MSNBC
105:21CTAkind You of know, that's so valuable because I remember having this conversation with my mother at the time when she was alive. So, like, the Gisela Maxwell trial is going on, but at the same time, they wheel out Johnny Depp and Amber Heard. So Giselaine Maxwell, that trial is closed, and Amber Heard and Johnny Depp are a public trial. Like, there you go. There's the red thread. Look over here. Never mind this,
105:46CTAbut look over here. It's very true. And having and having a like a reliable outlet, that's doing God's work, man. That's going be great. Well, what I love about it too is is I'm not up to date with a lot of things that are happening because I I don't I don't wanna get sucked into the theater. I don't know I know it's theater,
106:06CTAso I don't even know, like, with the Iran war. I I really have no fucking idea what's going on because I I don't feel like I can believe anybody. And so the fact that you're doing this, I can finally get some facts on on what's happening. And then if I run across a clip on Instagram, which I will try not to even watch because, again,
106:28CTAlike I'm susceptible like everybody else did this, like pinging something, me putting these two pieces of the story together that it's funny. For a long time,
106:39CTAI used to get all my news from like JP Sears. Mhmm. Because I'm like, he's breaking down the bullshit in it. And so I thought he was really great about that, and there are some other people on Tim Dillon's amazing. These days as well. Tim Dillon's amazing. Jason Sears just made two videos in a row about me. Oh, did he? They're really cool. Yeah. I met him at a party recently. He's gonna come on the podcast. He's a super cool dude.
107:00CTAYeah. He's a great I just met him at a little dinner party. He's Can you put us in touch? For sure. I'm sure he'd love to meet you. Yeah. He said he's been following my work for years. He's seen his fuck too. Like you shake his hand, and it's like it's iron. Like a little rock? Oh my god. Yeah. Damn. You'll love him. He's he's a great dude and he's been ever since 2020 happened, he just went full on into exposure.
107:24CTAYeah. He's doing he's doing very good work. Mhmm. I think the goal of this news channel is to feel like you just got a briefing from like a CIA mission planning executive. Like, it's an intelligence brief. Yeah. And and it will be like it's gonna look kinda like the news. Like, there's gonna be a pretty girl behind a desk and flashy
107:46CTAshit up behind her on a screen and stuff, but it it will be it will follow the identical format of a CIA intelligence brief, except you will get that's how you can get your news in the morning now. That's so good.
108:02CTAYou're doing God's work. Thank you so much. Thank you, guys. So are you. That was great. And I I also one of the reasons I came down here is for more unlearned merch. You came to the right place, Okay. Let's go take care of into storage closet, you just go shopping. We'll get you a big old bag and
— full transcript
§ 05 · For Joe
Steal the format.
The Great Unlearn playbook
Open with a ninety-second feature-film sizzle, then let the conversation run unhurried for an hour and forty minutes — the cold open does the selling, the body does the relationship-building.
- Front-load a 90-second supercut where the guest's biggest claims fire back-to-back — that's the trailer that earns the next 100 minutes.
- Use VHS-glitch overlays + word-pop captions only inside the cold open, then drop the chrome entirely for the main body so the conversation feels unfiltered by contrast.
- Treat the guest's catchphrase as a hook line at minute 0 and again at the end — Chase's 'theater' frame opens the episode and closes the episode (the news channel pitch).
- Three-person setup beats two for long-form: Cal pushes for clarity, Adam reflects and pitches the product, Chase delivers — none of them are doing all three jobs.
- Plant the product pitch (MaxStack) as the third-to-last beat, not the last — let the guest's vision (Chase's news channel) take the closing slot so the episode ends on idealism, not commerce.
- Let guests bring frameworks — 'what does that person want me to think', the 'They' game, story-archetype persuasion — and the audience will share the clip just to teach somebody else the framework.
- Don't fact-check inside the episode. The 950-missing-years tangent gets equal air time to the DMT story — the format trusts the listener to sort it.
§ 05 · For You
What this could mean for you.
If you took this episode seriously
Most of your reaction to the news, to other people, and to your own past is not yours — it's an archetype completing itself in your head. The whole conversation is one long argument for taking back the camera.
- Next time a headline grabs you, ask Chase's two-step question: 'What do they want me to think?' and 'What would they be afraid of if that were true?' It works on bumper stickers, dating-app bios, and CNN equally.
- Notice when two stories get placed near each other with no causal link between them. Your brain will draw the line — that's not insight, that's manipulation. Catch yourself feeling clever.
- When you're stuck on something heavy from your past, don't try to drop the trauma. Try to move the camera. Same memory, different angle, mature perspective — Chase argues that's literally all psychedelic therapy is doing.
- If a person around you is exhausting, ask what story-archetype they're stuck in (victim, downtrodden hero, tragedy). You can love them without yanking them out of their arc — that's just a boundary.
- Steal the 'they hate this' filter for your own life: notice what the algorithm, the supplement industry, the news cycle, and big platforms all seem to push you away from. Real food. Real friends. Sunlight. Sex with one person. Movement. Quiet. Lean toward the things being pulled away from you.
- If you're parenting, the high-leverage age is younger than you think. Chase started the 'what do they want me to think' drill at age 9. Earlier is better.
- If psychedelics keep coming up in your life, the responsible on-ramp Chase and Adam describe is microdosing with intention — not a five-hour IV DMT cannonball. Start small enough to stay in your life.
