WEBVTT 00:00:00.320 --> 00:00:14.675 Ermes agent. You're seeing it everywhere. People are calling it the OpenCloud killer, and today's episode is about how you can actually install it, how you can connect it with g stack by Gary Tan, how you can connect it to Obsidian, how you can create skills. 00:00:14.835 --> 00:00:30.170 We go through step by step how you can get started with Hermes agent. This is everything you need to know for how to run it, get started, and actually how you can even use it on an Android device. So enjoy the episode. It's with my dear friend, Imran, 00:00:30.330 --> 00:00:38.490 who just explains technical concepts in such a such a clear way. It's a breath of fresh air. Enjoy the episode, the introduction to Hermes Agents. 00:00:46.675 --> 00:00:49.875 I begged them to come on and Imran has come on. 00:00:50.355 --> 00:01:13.245 Uh, thank you for for for coming on. By the end of this episode, Imran, what are people gonna get? By the end of this episode, you'll learn how to install Ermes agent, which is the best personal agent. It has built in memory. It learns about your workflows and helps save you time, money, and allows you to do more. And I'll even show you how to install it on an Android phone. Okay. Cool. Yeah. So I've been hearing a lot about Hermes. 00:01:13.405 --> 00:01:17.885 Obviously, it's going viral. Is it the new Open Claw? I don't know. Imran, 00:01:17.885 --> 00:01:22.045 I I just need you to explain it in the simplest terms, the most clear terms 00:01:22.370 --> 00:01:27.410 so that after at the end of this episode, I can actually go on my computer, get Hermes going. 00:01:28.530 --> 00:01:33.970 So you're committing to to making it as clear as possible and and sharing as much sauce as possible? 00:01:34.370 --> 00:01:43.225 Exactly. Yeah. That's what I'll do. Alright. Alright. Let's do it. Alright. So the first thing, uh, the way that I found Ermes agent was that I tried using OpenClaw. 00:01:43.385 --> 00:01:47.225 And when I was using OpenClaw, I ran into basically three massive issues. 00:01:47.625 --> 00:02:10.525 The first issue is that I kept having to tell it to do the same things over and over again because there was no built in memory system. Right? And this is a common problem. Uh, the second problem I found was that I had to keep restarting the gateway. I think there was a day where I had to restart the gateway once an hour. And so that was, like, really useless. I felt like I spent more time setting up OpenClaw than I was actually like using 00:02:10.925 --> 00:02:13.005 it to make my life better. 00:02:13.245 --> 00:02:19.965 And the third big problem with OpenClaw for me was just that it was eating up tokens and I had no visibility into how or why. 00:02:20.740 --> 00:02:27.860 So I quickly migrated over to Nebula, which is if you're looking to build, uh, if you're looking to kinda have just like a AI coworker, 00:02:28.100 --> 00:02:30.020 Nebula is probably the better tool. 00:02:30.420 --> 00:02:53.880 Um, but if you wanna have like personalized workflows, if wanna kinda tinker under their hood, and you wanna have a system that learns over time, I highly suggest using Ermes. So, uh, the the three things that Ermes does better than OpenClaw are basically solving the three problems that I mentioned. One is that it has a built in memory system. So every time you complete a task and successfully complete it, it automatically writes to its own memory. 00:02:54.280 --> 00:02:59.560 This way, like, over time, it gets better. Um, it also uses a typical, 00:02:59.560 --> 00:03:01.240 like, normal SQL lite database, 00:03:01.575 --> 00:03:04.615 which is the same type of database as, you know, normal web applications. 00:03:04.775 --> 00:03:08.135 And what that allows it to do is search in real time 00:03:08.375 --> 00:03:28.010 for times where it's done something successfully for you. So if it didn't save it to its memory, it can actually go and search through all of the logs of all the things you've asked it to do and remember it. Even things like API keys, if you forget to save them to an environment variable, but you kind of passed it to the agent, it can actually search through and find it for you. 00:03:28.330 --> 00:03:33.105 Uh, and the last thing is it's just more stable. Like, haven't had to restart it in, like, over a week, 00:03:33.425 --> 00:03:35.905 which is way better than what happened with OpenClaw. 00:03:36.305 --> 00:03:40.785 So I'll walk you guys through the installation. But before I do, Greg, do you have any questions so far? 00:03:41.680 --> 00:03:42.640 Yeah. I mean, 00:03:43.920 --> 00:03:52.400 I guess I'll see by the end of this. But, you know, for me it's like, I think a lot of us listening, we might have heard of OpenClaw or might have start you know, installed OpenClaw. 00:03:54.635 --> 00:03:58.075 You know, I I'm just what I'm begging to know is, like 00:03:59.035 --> 00:04:01.115 what I don't want actually, should restart. 00:04:01.275 --> 00:04:04.395 What I don't wanna have happen is I install Hermes, 00:04:04.395 --> 00:04:09.595 and then a week later, I go back to OpenClaw, basically. You know what I mean? Like, I just kinda wanna pick an ecosystem 00:04:10.010 --> 00:04:12.490 and be like, this is my personal agent. 00:04:12.810 --> 00:04:25.355 Mhmm. No. Makes a lot of sense. And that's kind of the problem that I was having before. I kept switching and jumping between different agents until I landed on Hermes and I've been using it for over three weeks now, which in this space is a lot of time. 00:04:25.995 --> 00:04:33.835 Um, so I'll before we get into the installation, I'll walk you really quickly on my setup. So when you just type in Hermes in your terminal after it's installed, 00:04:34.075 --> 00:04:36.475 um, it's gonna try to open up my Xcode 00:04:36.640 --> 00:04:40.080 m c p, which is not running right now, so it'll it'll fire up in a second. 00:04:40.480 --> 00:04:41.120 Cool. 00:04:42.240 --> 00:04:48.800 Yeah. And I'll zoom out a little bit. You can see here, um, when you open up Hermes for the first time, 00:04:49.280 --> 00:05:10.340 on the top, you'll see the available tools. So Hermes comes built in with 40 plus built in tools that OpenCloud doesn't have. So you'll have to go find out which tools to install. Uh, many of the built in tools will cover almost all of the basic tasks that you'll need to do. If you wanna fire up a browser, if you wanna search the web, if you wanna create recurring scheduled 00:05:10.340 --> 00:05:18.900 cron jobs or like scheduled like code, um, it has all of that built in. Even things like image generation are built in, home assistant capabilities. 00:05:18.980 --> 00:05:24.075 You don't really have to configure or go figure out what the best tools are. 00:05:24.395 --> 00:05:52.665 Um, the other thing you'll notice about Hermes when you first install it is that it has a lot of the really most popular available skills pre installed as well. So like I'm on a MacBook, so it has all of like the Apple notes, Apple reminders. It's got find my, it's got iMessage. I did not have to go and find this from a skills hub. It was already ready to go as soon as I installed it. So if you wanna talk about simplicity of installation and having all those skills you need, Hermes is probably the best one for that. 00:05:52.985 --> 00:05:54.585 What about security? 00:05:54.665 --> 00:05:58.585 Like are those like if I install some of those skills, 00:05:59.305 --> 00:06:00.025 are those 00:06:00.345 --> 00:06:02.585 like do I have peace of mind knowing that that's secure? 00:06:03.560 --> 00:06:21.185 Yeah. No. That's a really good question. Um, so there's a couple ways around this. One, I think you can always ask the agent to do an audit of your security setup, uh, which a lot of people don't think about. It's kinda almost like meta prompting it. So Hermes has knowledge of where the keys are stored in your configuration, 00:06:21.345 --> 00:06:56.345 um, and you can say, is this a secure setup? Tell me why or why not. And it'll go through and let you know if there are any secret keys exposed on your computer, if they're in plain text, if like a firewall is set up poorly, it'll let you know. Um, the other thing that's very unique to Hermes is that it's built to also, out of the box, be able to be ran inside of a Docker container in case you want it on your machine but isolated from the rest of your files. And then you can also run it on modal as like a serverless service as well. So it's really flexible in how you win. I personally am a little bit risky and I just kinda run it on the bare metal. 00:06:57.210 --> 00:07:06.330 And I'm just routinely making sure like every day I'm updating it and I'm also making sure that like I ask it to, you know, secure my own setup. 00:07:06.730 --> 00:07:09.050 Cool. Let's let's keep going. Alright. 00:07:09.130 --> 00:07:12.410 So the installation, if you're on a Mac, is pretty straightforward. 00:07:13.425 --> 00:07:15.825 You can just head over to the Ermes agent 00:07:16.385 --> 00:07:17.345 documentation. 00:07:17.345 --> 00:07:24.545 It's on the new research website. And if you're on Linux, Mac OS, or even Windows Subsystem for Linux, it's just this one line command. 00:07:24.945 --> 00:07:28.465 If it's your first time installing a tool like this on a Mac, 00:07:29.160 --> 00:07:39.320 you'll probably need to install the Xcode developer tools. So I covered that in the video that Greg found me through, but basically you would do like Xcode dash select dash dash install. 00:07:40.280 --> 00:07:42.840 You can see this command right here and I will actually 00:07:44.425 --> 00:07:51.785 run it here. Um, I already have it installed, you can see, and if you need to update it, you can update it later. Um, so, yeah, you can just go ahead and copy this command 00:07:52.745 --> 00:07:57.705 and paste it in and it'll run. Now, obviously, I have it installed as already, 00:07:57.705 --> 00:07:59.625 so it'll just go through the update. 00:08:01.650 --> 00:08:04.930 Another thing that I found was that you can actually skip 00:08:05.010 --> 00:08:07.970 the, um, you can skip the onboarding 00:08:08.050 --> 00:08:17.335 and you can just close out of it. Um, and the most important commands that you'll need to know once you have it installed is just this one right here, is Ermes model. 00:08:17.415 --> 00:08:26.615 So this kind of brings me into the next, uh, the next problem that I had with OpenClaw, which was that with OpenClaw, I just did not have enough visibility into how much I was spending on tokens. 00:08:27.095 --> 00:08:35.150 And I was like it was like a constant battle to figure out like exactly which model to use. Oh, wait. I gotta run the install again. Let's try one more time. 00:08:36.030 --> 00:08:39.390 I think I broke it. Also with OpenClaw, 00:08:39.390 --> 00:08:40.830 you can't use 00:08:41.950 --> 00:08:42.670 Anthropic 00:08:43.015 --> 00:08:45.015 anymore. Right? So with 00:08:45.175 --> 00:08:46.055 Hermes, 00:08:46.055 --> 00:08:49.175 can you use an Anthropic API key 00:08:49.335 --> 00:08:50.215 seamlessly? 00:08:51.095 --> 00:08:55.335 Correct. Yeah. You can use, uh, you can use an Anthropic API key. You also have access to 00:08:56.130 --> 00:09:07.410 the, uh, new router as well. So let me show you. Alright. So this is a this is one that's running on my gaming PC just I had this as a backup. So if we type or let me clear this out so it's easier. 00:09:07.570 --> 00:09:08.530 And I'll type 00:09:09.970 --> 00:09:11.250 Hermes model. 00:09:11.655 --> 00:09:18.295 And here you can see, um, these are all the different providers that you can use to select a model. Again, this is already 00:09:18.295 --> 00:09:22.535 out like, this is all, like, out of the box. I did not have to go install anything. 00:09:23.015 --> 00:09:27.175 Um, and the two biggest ways to save money on this is really just to use either the new portal 00:09:27.440 --> 00:09:30.320 or OpenRouter. So if I go on OpenRouter, can see 00:09:30.880 --> 00:09:33.200 I'll be able to see all of the different models. 00:09:33.840 --> 00:09:38.480 And the cool thing about OpenRouter is that every once in a while, you'll have some free models available. 00:09:38.720 --> 00:09:41.200 So here NVIDIA's Nemotron, 00:09:41.360 --> 00:09:55.535 uh, is free this week. So if you wanted to use that model and you just want to run it for completely free, it's available as well. You can see also through OpenRouter, I'm able to access Anthropix models here. Remember you're asking. So they're both available 00:09:56.530 --> 00:10:06.290 And you can see a very clear layout of exactly how much it'll cost. So, you know, if I if I wanna use Quen 3.6 plus, it's probably only gonna cost me 33ยข 00:10:06.290 --> 00:10:07.650 per million tokens, 00:10:07.970 --> 00:10:10.130 uh, for input and about a dollar 95 00:10:10.335 --> 00:10:14.095 per million tokens of output. And you can see the price difference between 00:10:14.975 --> 00:10:22.015 SONNET and QUEN. Right? So you could it's like almost like one tenth the price on the input tokens which is like really good. 00:10:23.030 --> 00:10:32.310 Mean, you sort of know in sense, like, you know how much you're gonna spend on tokens. You don't really know once you have it set up, like, how you know, what your date 00:10:32.470 --> 00:10:35.270 well, I mean, you'll find out basically Yeah. Based on the 00:10:37.635 --> 00:10:43.075 the task you give it, how much things are gonna cost. And and I think that that's sort of 00:10:44.675 --> 00:10:52.995 the issue I think some people are having is, like, they're spending I mean, it's not crazy to spend hundreds of dollars a day on your OpenClaw instance at this point. 00:10:53.850 --> 00:11:21.555 Yeah. So actually the one of the interesting ways to fix that using the Ermes agent, um, is that you can actually once you have a task that you know that you wanna run rip like on a recurring basis, you can actually have it write the code one time for it. So instead of requiring an agent in the loop every single time that you need to do something, you can actually write the code to make it like more deterministic. And that'll actually long term save you tokens because you won't be spending tokens on 00:11:21.795 --> 00:11:22.675 actually, 00:11:22.755 --> 00:11:26.720 um, like doing the processing every single time. Like, 00:11:26.960 --> 00:11:36.960 you'll just do it the first time, get it to write the code. And then, you know, if you're using a free model, you can use the free model to write the code and then you basically will spend no tokens on that singular skill or task forever. 00:11:37.985 --> 00:11:41.665 That's like another thing that I noticed. I I realized that a lot of people are not 00:11:42.225 --> 00:11:47.585 if if you come from a software engineering world, you're always kind of thinking in this methodology of like don't repeat yourself. 00:11:48.225 --> 00:12:01.470 Yeah. Like if you are like in the habit of like building reports every single day or you want like kind of, like, a daily digest, a lot of those things can be automated with just pure code instead of relying on an LLM to do, like, a web scrape or something like that. And that will also save you a bunch of tokens. 00:12:01.870 --> 00:12:06.110 Um, so by just switching to Ermes Agent and OpenRouter, 00:12:06.110 --> 00:12:10.725 I basically got my token spend down from like it was like about like a $130 00:12:10.725 --> 00:12:14.085 every five days down to like maybe like $10 a $10 00:12:14.085 --> 00:12:17.765 every five days. So about like a a little bit over a 90% reduction. 00:12:18.725 --> 00:12:20.725 And I'm still able to do all the things that I wanna do. 00:12:22.830 --> 00:12:33.870 The other important thing that I think everyone will want to know is that, of course, Hermes agent does allow you to have a connection to Telegram. So you can see all my agents here are named after the Muppets. 00:12:34.725 --> 00:12:44.565 So I still have a lot of room for expansion if I need to add more agents. There's still a bunch more Muppets I can go through. Um, and I can talk to them in Telegram just like how I can talk to them inside 00:12:44.645 --> 00:12:45.685 of the terminal. 00:12:46.290 --> 00:13:00.930 And this Cookie Monster one is super special because if you kind of take a sneak peek at the screen here, this one is actually running on a Solana Seeker Android phone that I have right here. So I wanted to talk a little bit about that because I got this set up finally yesterday. 00:13:01.985 --> 00:13:11.665 If you want to set up Hermes agent on an Android phone, you'll see here that there's actually, uh, the same way that you install it on your computer. 00:13:11.825 --> 00:13:25.250 There is a script that you can install to put it on an Android phone. And so here I have installed it on the Android phone and you can see what device am I on and it says here I'm on a Seeker Android 15 phone running via Termux. 00:13:25.730 --> 00:13:35.855 So That's really Yeah. So and then people are like if some of the people who saw that I was doing this on Twitter were asking like, oh, like, why would I install it on an Android phone instead of installing it on a computer? 00:13:36.575 --> 00:13:45.350 So before I get into that, uh, I will say that the there are a few extra steps for installing it on Android. The first thing is that you need an app called Termux. 00:13:45.430 --> 00:13:52.230 Termux is basically like a a terminal inside of Android. So it'll kinda look exactly like your normal Mac term terminal. 00:13:52.790 --> 00:13:55.510 And then if you wanna extend it even further, 00:13:55.670 --> 00:13:58.515 there's another app called the Termux API. 00:13:58.995 --> 00:14:07.155 And the Termux API app, um, it's it's available on the f droid, which is an open source, uh, Android app store. 00:14:07.475 --> 00:14:15.610 Uh, but the Termux API actually gives you access to the sensor data on your phone. So you can access information about the battery, 00:14:15.850 --> 00:14:18.010 you can change the WiFi network, 00:14:18.090 --> 00:14:22.650 you can change the volume of the device, you can take photos using the Android phone, 00:14:22.970 --> 00:14:25.770 uh, you can adjust the brightness, you can trigger the vibration motor. 00:14:26.295 --> 00:14:52.530 There's like all basically everything that the Android phone has access to, you now have access to. So you can imagine a world where instead of having this running on a Mac mini, which is like sold out, you can have it running on an Android phone that's, you know, Android phones are very cheap and you can put a SIM card inside of it, you can bring it with you, you can have it read your text messages that are sent directly to that number, you can automate basically a two factor authentication that comes in via SMS. 00:14:53.215 --> 00:14:58.895 And basically, like, you now have a version of, an always on low power 00:14:59.295 --> 00:15:03.135 dedicated agent device that isn't a Mac mini and that isn't as expensive. 00:15:04.095 --> 00:15:08.255 A lot of people listen to this podcast, the startup ideas podcast because, 00:15:09.000 --> 00:15:10.040 you know, I 00:15:10.520 --> 00:15:17.400 I don't just bring on people who, you know, give practical AI tutorials, but also they like ideas, they like ways to make money using some of these, 00:15:17.720 --> 00:15:19.960 you know, new technologies and stuff like that. 00:15:20.855 --> 00:15:21.655 You know, 00:15:22.055 --> 00:15:23.415 with the Android 00:15:23.495 --> 00:15:25.895 Hermes instance specifically, 00:15:26.375 --> 00:15:29.255 can do you have any ideas that come to mind around like, 00:15:29.975 --> 00:15:33.575 you know, if I were trying to make money with Hermes agent 00:15:33.655 --> 00:15:34.615 on Android, 00:15:35.570 --> 00:15:41.650 you know, what are what are the some things that come to mind, top of mind? Yeah. The first thing is 00:15:41.890 --> 00:15:42.690 probably 00:15:42.770 --> 00:15:45.090 because you have access to the Termux API, 00:15:45.250 --> 00:15:49.810 you can actually fire off commands on the Android phone itself. Like, you can tap the screen 00:15:50.465 --> 00:15:52.385 and you can like send notifications. 00:15:52.625 --> 00:16:08.130 So if I think one of the next things I wanna set up is of course, like everyone, some sort of like social media automation that uses the phone directly. So right now we have a lot of scheduler tools and people complain that social media scheduling tools, they nerf your reach because, 00:16:08.450 --> 00:16:15.890 you know, like, they're going through the API instead of on the device. Well, this kinda solves that because you can actually post the content directly from the device. 00:16:16.450 --> 00:16:27.285 Um, that's one thing that's, like, super cool. Right? So instead of having to, you know, literally, like, open up your phone and download a video that's generated and post it that way, uh, you could have this technically running on 00:16:27.765 --> 00:16:35.710 an almost infinitely scalable amount of Android phones and run accounts and post from there. And it will still show that it came from a device with like a real MAC address. 00:16:36.110 --> 00:16:37.150 That's one way. 00:16:37.630 --> 00:16:42.750 Another thing that I've seen is just of course, like, there's like the make money part of it, 00:16:43.390 --> 00:16:46.270 but also, you know, I have a lot of the very basic 00:16:46.775 --> 00:16:56.775 parts of my life that are annoying, like, already automated. So, like, I have an email triaging agent that every morning goes through my emails, deletes the ones that are, like, unnecessary, unsubscribes 00:16:56.775 --> 00:16:59.895 from things that I subscribe to that are, like, really useless, 00:17:00.430 --> 00:17:09.070 and then shows me a digest of the important emails. That might not directly make me more money right now, but it's still saving me about, like, thirty minutes to an hour a day and just allowing me to do more. 00:17:09.630 --> 00:17:12.990 Cool. Yeah. I think the hard part is just figuring out 00:17:13.565 --> 00:17:15.805 like, taking stock auditing 00:17:15.965 --> 00:17:22.285 your your personal life to be like, are the things I need automated? Mhmm. And then also from a business perspective, 00:17:22.925 --> 00:17:33.360 what are the things I need to be automated? I think that's part of the hard part. And I guess, like, you know, you could you can ask Ermez's agent to audit your life, right, and start asking you questions 00:17:33.840 --> 00:17:44.995 to help you like, ask it to help you, you know? Yeah. Like, we can do this. Like, where do I spend the bulk of my time? And let's see if it knows from my memories. And if this gets too intimate, we can always cut it out. 00:17:47.795 --> 00:17:56.970 That's what we want, Imran. We wanted to get into it. Yeah. So like it knows where I live, knows what times that I'm in. It's like, okay, where do I spend time? What am I asking questions about? 00:17:58.010 --> 00:18:00.490 That's awesome. Is that something that you recommend 00:18:00.650 --> 00:18:01.290 people, 00:18:02.650 --> 00:18:14.295 you know, use Hermes agent to help help you set it up and and and productize some some of the stuff that you're doing? Yeah. So I think, like, the idea of using agents to get things done is like a new paradigm. 00:18:14.695 --> 00:18:38.020 So the easiest way to, like, get used to it is to solve, like, personal problems in your life. So the biggest, like, personal problem that I first solved with an agent was, um, like, figuring out what to cook at home because my wife and I, like, we love DoorDashing, we love eating out, but, obviously, like, that's not, you know, that's not the healthiest and that also costs a lot of money. So the first thing I did was I set up a local speech to text model on my actual computer 00:18:38.395 --> 00:18:43.995 and I sent a a long, like, eight minute telegram voice message of me going through my fridge and my pantry 00:18:44.155 --> 00:19:00.420 of every single thing and every single ingredient that's in my pantry. And I said every day, can you send me a recipe or three recipes based on what's in my pantry and what, like, my fitness goals are? Um, it seems like something small, but it kinda takes a lot of, like, mental load away from, like, my day to day. 00:19:00.740 --> 00:19:04.900 Um, there's a lot of things, like, I think that if you start doing, like, really basic stuff like that, 00:19:05.300 --> 00:19:07.265 um, you know, like 00:19:07.345 --> 00:19:12.625 we can you can kinda automate a lot. Also, we gotta we gotta cut this out, bro. There's a lot of personal stuff in here. 00:19:13.745 --> 00:19:15.185 Is there's 00:19:15.185 --> 00:19:16.625 no way too much. 00:19:16.945 --> 00:19:24.160 Rafa, let's blur it out. We're gonna blur it out. So Okay. We have to blur this out. It's a lot, bro. It's a lot. We're 00:19:24.160 --> 00:19:32.480 blurring it up, but we're keeping this in the sense that, like, if you do this, it works. Exactly. Yeah. It does work. It's very intimate, so definitely can't show you guys everything. 00:19:33.455 --> 00:19:39.775 It's intimate also because it knows you. Right? Mhmm. And you've you put in the work with it. Right? So if you're starting this from scratch, 00:19:40.175 --> 00:19:53.600 it won't be intimate. Right? It won't be. Yeah. So, like, when you started from scratch, like, you'll have all the tools, you'll have the skills. As you talk to it every single day and you use it for work over and over again, it'll like I said, it'll store in its memory. It'll begin to learn exactly 00:19:53.760 --> 00:20:08.765 what you do, what, like, um, and how it can help you. And you can even ask it, like, every night you can ask it, like, what's one or two things that you can build for me that would make my life better? And it'll do that for you. Okay. What are what are other must know things about Hermes agent? 00:20:09.005 --> 00:20:12.285 You do still have to update it every night. It's still technically beta software. 00:20:13.100 --> 00:20:16.940 So you can see I haven't updated this one since 00:20:16.940 --> 00:20:20.940 in nine days and I am five hundred and thirty five commits behind, 00:20:21.260 --> 00:20:23.420 which is quite a bit. 00:20:24.220 --> 00:20:27.740 So you do still have to update it every single day. It is still technically 00:20:28.375 --> 00:20:29.735 beta software. 00:20:29.735 --> 00:20:31.415 You still should probably 00:20:31.655 --> 00:20:32.615 constantly, 00:20:32.615 --> 00:20:34.855 you know, lock it down in certain ways. 00:20:35.335 --> 00:20:37.255 A really simple way to 00:20:37.495 --> 00:20:43.095 lock down Ermes agent but still have access to it from anywhere is one to set up like Telegram or WhatsApp. 00:20:43.930 --> 00:20:55.770 Another thing that I highly recommend for any of these tools is that you install Tailscale and you configure Tailscale correctly. So Tailscale will allow your phone and all of your computers to be on the same kind of virtual network, 00:20:56.545 --> 00:21:05.505 And then you can remotely access them using any like terminal SSH app. We just let you kind of remote in and like monitor it and chat with it that way as well. 00:21:06.065 --> 00:21:14.860 Before before we head out, is there a question that I shoulda asked you about Hermes' agent that I didn't ask you? Should you migrate from OpenClot? 00:21:15.420 --> 00:21:17.500 I mean, I've got my 00:21:18.220 --> 00:21:20.620 yeah. I mean, that's the big question. Right? Should you 00:21:21.420 --> 00:21:29.725 now that we've seen it, I mean well, we've we've sort of you know, I should've I let's actually would you be open to showing your Muppets? 00:21:29.805 --> 00:21:30.925 Yeah. Yeah. 00:21:31.245 --> 00:21:31.965 Yeah. 00:21:32.285 --> 00:21:33.725 And and also, 00:21:33.965 --> 00:21:34.525 like, 00:21:35.005 --> 00:21:36.765 with respect to your Muppets, like, 00:21:38.045 --> 00:21:43.420 does it make sense to set up, you know, one agent, multiple agents? 00:21:43.740 --> 00:21:46.060 Like, how how do people think about designing 00:21:46.460 --> 00:22:05.305 their their agents? You know, like, do I create one that's called, like, social media manager and it's just doing social media stuff? Or how should I think about this? Yeah. So this is something that's still kind of a work in progress for me as well. Yeah. So you can see count, uh, is is, uh, is my main kind of agent. It's the one that's running on my gaming computer. 00:22:05.625 --> 00:22:16.420 Um, and you can see this has all of like my personal stuff set up. So I have cron jobs for like doing my Gmail triage, for unsubscribing to emails, to give me like expense reports, 00:22:16.900 --> 00:22:30.675 like some more personal stuff, like finance stuff is all set up here. Um, these are technically cron jobs, they're not sub agents. I have seen people set these up as sub agents. The benefit of that is that you can assign specific models to each one. 00:22:30.995 --> 00:23:12.470 So I could have a Gmail email triage sub agent that I have assigned a cheaper model to, right, because it's more deterministic and it'll tell me like, if if it's, a really simple task, you can assign a, like, a a cheaper model to it, um, and kinda save money that way and you can add, like, more specific instructions. But I've also seen people just set it up as a cron job. So I have it set up as a cron job. I don't have it set up as a sub agent. Um, so I think a lot of these kind of specifics are still being figured out. We don't really know if it's better to have it as a sub agent or not. The thing that is that we can agree on is that having an agent that has memory and learns over time is incredibly powerful. 00:23:13.030 --> 00:23:24.325 Um, and I have four set up here just because I'm like a tinkerer, but I actually think the most optimal way to do it is to have one set up or two. And the only reason why I say two is 00:23:25.205 --> 00:23:31.045 if you have one for work and one for personal stuff. Like, I imagine if I worked at, like, a Fortune 500 company, 00:23:31.285 --> 00:23:39.950 they wouldn't let me, like, run Urmesh Agent with all my personal stuff on it on my work computer. But I still wanna have the capabilities of being able to kinda, like, automate or do work really efficiently. 00:23:40.350 --> 00:23:40.990 Mhmm. 00:23:41.230 --> 00:23:43.310 It's also it feels cleaner 00:23:43.470 --> 00:23:48.270 a little bit if it's personal and work. Like, my to do list, for example, I have 00:23:48.670 --> 00:23:50.670 like, the way I run my life, you know, 00:23:51.625 --> 00:23:57.145 I use things, the to do to do app, and I just have personal and and work. 00:23:57.625 --> 00:24:18.120 And, like, to me, that just, like, makes the most sense. So, like, when I the way I'm gonna set this up after this call is I'm gonna set up a personal one, I'm gonna set up a work one. Yeah. And I I think, um, another thing that maybe we didn't cover that I think we talked about a little bit on Twitter is that, um, this is like Obsidian. So, uh, I was never a big Obsidian fan. I kinda just stored everything in my Apple notes, 00:24:18.520 --> 00:24:23.885 um, and kinda hope for the best. The The cool thing about Obsidian is that even if you have, like, multiple agents, 00:24:24.125 --> 00:24:49.870 um, it's all, like, markdown files. So now Yeah. This this tool that was, instead of having to know markdown, you can just tell agents to, like, organize them. So I have this kind of setup as just, my home MD file. So it tells me all the important things I need to know about this week. It tells me about, like, things I need to get done today, upcoming travel, things for, like, my day job, things for, like, you know, personal stuff, and it's all organized and set up automatically by the agent every day. 00:24:50.515 --> 00:24:53.555 And so I would not have been able to go through, 00:24:53.795 --> 00:24:59.075 like, the painstaking effort of, like, putting this together by myself every single morning. 00:25:00.115 --> 00:25:03.700 But now, like, I have an agent that does it for me and it's just so much easier. 00:25:04.020 --> 00:25:14.180 But this is like not something I would have done before. I would I I wouldn't think to use Obsidian in the past but because I now have agents I can kind of manipulate it really easily. It just makes it much more fun and easy to use. 00:25:14.865 --> 00:25:19.825 Right. So you're is your recommendation that, you know, once you get Hermes installed, 00:25:19.905 --> 00:25:20.865 post install, 00:25:21.105 --> 00:25:21.985 start, 00:25:22.145 --> 00:25:24.625 you know, using it with Obsidian? 00:25:24.785 --> 00:25:27.505 I think Obsidian is a really clean layout 00:25:27.810 --> 00:25:32.850 because if you look at like if you look at Telegram, like, some of these just kind of read as like massive 00:25:33.170 --> 00:25:37.250 walls of text and even if I even if I like organize 00:25:37.250 --> 00:25:47.805 it or even if I put something in like my sole MD file to specify that it should speak concisely, like, just it becomes really unruly and it's like really hard to find like the most important information. 00:25:48.045 --> 00:25:50.125 There are people that are like experimenting 00:25:50.125 --> 00:25:52.845 with building like kind of like mission control dashboards 00:25:53.325 --> 00:25:58.520 but I I I just feel like the easiest is like the one that you can see on your phone and your computer, you know. 00:25:58.840 --> 00:26:04.040 And if someone saw your Obsidian and is like, man, Imran has this really 00:26:04.200 --> 00:26:07.880 like that's that's my dream. How do I how do they go from 00:26:08.520 --> 00:26:18.465 like how do they make a similar thing? Like how how do you actually do that? Yeah. So my Obsidian was set up by my Hermes agent after using my Hermes agents for, like, twenty days. 00:26:18.785 --> 00:26:22.785 So So it's as it learned about me. Yeah. You think it you think it takes twenty days? 00:26:23.265 --> 00:26:31.410 No. I I think I think it takes I think it takes building up the habit of using of default going to the agent to get work done even if you can do it yourself. 00:26:31.730 --> 00:26:41.250 That's the biggest thing. Okay. So maybe it's like seven days maybe it's seven days of like using it, you know, consistently and then after that 00:26:41.785 --> 00:26:46.345 their Emez agent knows a, you know, a good chunk about you and then 00:26:46.585 --> 00:26:50.265 you can have it create a similar Obsidian stack. 00:26:50.665 --> 00:27:02.160 Mhmm. Right? Yeah. And and you still right now, you still kind of have to meta prompt it. So you can ask it at the end of every day like, what is something you should build for the work I do? Or what is one way that you can, 00:27:02.480 --> 00:27:14.005 uh, what is, like, one one task I'm doing over and over again that I should set up as a cron job? Um, and it'll know, but you still kind of have to prompt it. Right? So I'm hoping in the future that you don't have to do that. That it just kinda knows automatically, 00:27:14.085 --> 00:27:16.005 but we'll get there. We're pretty close. 00:27:16.485 --> 00:27:19.205 That's really interesting. Could you, like, open up 00:27:19.365 --> 00:27:28.780 I know this is we're we're sort of doing this live, but, could you open up, a doc just so and and just, like, write out, like, the the prompts that people 00:27:29.740 --> 00:27:31.660 should should be thinking about 00:27:31.900 --> 00:27:32.620 around 00:27:33.340 --> 00:27:41.005 around for for Hermes agent, like, what what are the ones that you're using, Emron, that you're like it seems obvious to you but, 00:27:41.325 --> 00:27:42.685 you know, people might, 00:27:42.925 --> 00:27:46.765 you know, not know. Yeah. A really basic one is like 00:27:47.085 --> 00:27:49.005 what have I been procrastinating? 00:27:49.725 --> 00:27:57.390 Right? That's a good one because it has access to your to do list. If you're listening to this podcast, like, you're probably doing a lot and there's probably something that's, 00:27:57.550 --> 00:28:05.230 like, you know, under the hood that, like, you just haven't gotten to yet. Another one is, um, what is the most important thing to work on today? 00:28:05.945 --> 00:28:08.105 Right? And, like, that's, like, super important. 00:28:09.545 --> 00:28:12.665 Another one would be, like I like I mentioned, like, what 00:28:13.225 --> 00:28:18.105 are some tasks that I'm doing every single day that I could or should automate? 00:28:20.180 --> 00:28:21.620 Another one would be, 00:28:23.300 --> 00:28:27.620 what is a tool that you can build me tonight that would make my life easier tomorrow? 00:28:28.580 --> 00:28:33.300 Right? Like, these types of things, like, where you're yeah. This you're right. This does kinda seem obvious to me, 00:28:34.095 --> 00:28:37.375 But to many people like it's kind of a new new way of thinking. 00:28:39.695 --> 00:28:41.135 I'm trying to think of another one. 00:28:43.215 --> 00:28:46.415 Is there anything important today that I've missed? Right? 00:28:47.330 --> 00:28:48.610 Anything around 00:28:48.690 --> 00:28:50.850 cron jobs, MD files? 00:28:52.850 --> 00:28:56.450 I'm trying to think. Yeah. I think I think I think 00:28:56.690 --> 00:29:03.135 the cron job setup could be is like a little bit difficult in the beginning because I feel that people 00:29:03.135 --> 00:29:03.855 don't 00:29:04.095 --> 00:29:04.975 understand, 00:29:04.975 --> 00:29:10.655 like, what a cron job is. It's still a very technical term, uh, but it's essentially just something that runs on a schedule. 00:29:11.055 --> 00:29:11.455 And 00:29:13.790 --> 00:29:20.350 you like, everyone does everyone has a list of tasks or a list of things that they do every single day that probably could or should be automated. Right? 00:29:20.910 --> 00:29:25.550 And so asking it to set up Cronjobs for those things will just kinda make your life a little bit easier. 00:29:26.715 --> 00:29:31.195 The last thing I did wanna show you now that I'm thinking about it is I actually have 00:29:32.235 --> 00:29:33.595 I wanna show you 00:29:34.395 --> 00:29:35.275 there 00:29:35.515 --> 00:29:36.155 was 00:29:36.635 --> 00:29:38.075 a psychiatrist 00:29:39.630 --> 00:29:40.350 that 00:29:40.670 --> 00:29:42.510 made a computer 00:29:43.230 --> 00:29:45.230 or made like a computer program. 00:29:46.110 --> 00:29:47.630 Yes. His name is 00:29:48.030 --> 00:29:48.910 Joseph 00:29:49.070 --> 00:29:49.950 Weisenbaum. 00:29:49.950 --> 00:29:53.390 And he made a natural language processing computer program 00:29:54.315 --> 00:29:59.515 over the course of three years at MIT that's basically like like a chatbot therapist. 00:30:00.475 --> 00:30:11.770 And I've actually loaded this up as a skill inside of Hermes where I can, like, talk to it every single day and, like, help it it it will basically help me self actualize about what I should also work on. 00:30:12.250 --> 00:30:17.210 So there's a lot of these like weird like little like niche like personal development things 00:30:17.530 --> 00:30:23.050 that you can actually build really easily. Right? It took them three years to build out this like natural language processing like kind of like 00:30:24.165 --> 00:30:32.165 psychiatrist thing. But like you can just drop this Wikipedia file inside of your MMS agent and say like you'll turn this into a skill and it'll do it. 00:30:34.565 --> 00:30:36.005 That's really cool. 00:30:36.245 --> 00:30:36.565 Yeah. 00:30:39.400 --> 00:30:47.720 Yeah. That's sort of the daunting part about, you know, be it OpenClaw or Hermes is, like, you sort of need the ideas around 00:30:48.040 --> 00:30:55.205 like, I'm sure a lot of people wouldn't have come across that, you know, Wikipedia article and been like, oh, I should make this a skill. Right? So 00:30:55.685 --> 00:30:56.885 the prompting 00:30:56.885 --> 00:30:58.245 yourself to actually 00:30:59.525 --> 00:31:10.950 think about like, oh, I'm navigating the Internet or I'm navigating the world. How can I make this a skill so that I can use this every day? Just has to be a part of your it's it's just how you work today in the AJAI. 00:31:10.950 --> 00:31:17.430 Yeah. Exactly. The biggest thing is, like, learning how to use Irma's agent is not actually the skill. It's gonna become the requirement. You know? 00:31:17.910 --> 00:31:18.870 Exactly. 00:31:18.870 --> 00:31:29.395 Yeah. And whether it's, like, Irma's today, maybe OpenClaw gets better, maybe Claude Cowork, maybe it's Nebula, whatever it is, like, you still need to know what to do with it, and that's, like, kinda where where it counts. 00:31:30.275 --> 00:31:33.475 Last question around skills. I know that you showed 00:31:35.200 --> 00:31:37.040 some pre built Hermes 00:31:37.040 --> 00:31:38.000 skills. 00:31:40.640 --> 00:31:43.200 You know, what are what are some, 00:31:43.920 --> 00:31:48.160 you know, must install skills that you recommend for people listening? 00:31:48.595 --> 00:31:51.875 Yeah. So I definitely recommend installing the Obsidian skill. 00:31:52.835 --> 00:31:57.795 Um, I actually don't even use the Obsidian CLI, but I use the Obsidian skill. That one's really important. 00:31:58.355 --> 00:32:01.635 I've seen some people install the honcho dev memory skill. 00:32:02.090 --> 00:32:07.610 I haven't needed to set that up yet, though I think I probably will because there are some memory limits 00:32:07.770 --> 00:32:10.890 on Hermes and you kinda wanna keep like your context 00:32:10.890 --> 00:32:12.730 as small as possible. 00:32:13.130 --> 00:32:17.210 Um, another really useful one let me see from my ghosty. 00:32:19.665 --> 00:32:22.065 Well, so a lot of these skills I've built myself. Right? 00:32:22.545 --> 00:32:39.760 Like, I have, like, a bank statement analysis one. So I definitely think, like, whatever you do, you should always, like, start with, like try to build out your own skills around, like, personal finance and like fitness and like all the things that you already pay for. Um, and maybe those aren't ones that you actually go down, but they're ones that you build. 00:32:40.160 --> 00:32:46.320 Um, another really interesting one that I think everyone should play around with are of course all of the software development related skills. 00:32:46.865 --> 00:32:50.145 I even you can see here, I actually ported over g stack 00:32:50.465 --> 00:32:57.025 by Gary Tan into Hermes before it was widely available on Hermes. So I definitely you know, if you're working on a startup, 00:32:57.905 --> 00:33:00.785 it's definitely like a really cool cool skill to use g stack. 00:33:02.280 --> 00:33:10.040 And yeah, like I think those are the big ones. Just because I think some people don't know what g stack is, can you just give a quick primer on what g stack is 00:33:10.360 --> 00:33:11.000 and 00:33:11.320 --> 00:33:25.875 you know, how why you think that people should install g stack with Hermes? Yeah. Yeah. So g stack is basically the way I understand it, um, is it was built for a Claude code and it was made by Gary Tan, the CEO of Y Combinator. 00:33:26.115 --> 00:33:27.075 Um, essentially, 00:33:27.155 --> 00:33:31.395 the idea is that it takes the Y Combinator style startup process, 00:33:31.970 --> 00:33:40.930 which is like figuring out what works week over week, asking the right questions about what you should improve about your product and your business, and then helping you go and implement that as code, 00:33:41.170 --> 00:33:57.425 um, and make decisions on that. So, um, those types of things were previously only available to people who were in Y Combinator, which was like the best which is like the one of the best startup accelerators in the world. Um, but now a lot of that knowledge has been basically open sourced as a skill that you can bolt on to your agent. 00:33:57.825 --> 00:34:00.945 Um, and that's something that like was never available before in the past. 00:34:01.780 --> 00:34:04.660 So if you're obviously working on a startup like an app or something 00:34:05.300 --> 00:34:10.260 and you're not in San Francisco or maybe like you're not familiar with like the startup methodologies, 00:34:10.260 --> 00:34:12.340 I highly recommend using something like that. 00:34:12.740 --> 00:34:20.495 And it's a no brainer. It's free. It's free. Yeah. Yeah. It's like the the agent itself is like it's like Hermes agent is like basically 00:34:20.735 --> 00:34:35.340 like it's like nineties tuner car culture. Right? Like you can go find the parts you want and you can put them on and you should like learn how to customize it for yourself. As long as you remember that like customizing it is not the skill but it's more about what you get done with it. Right. And I think it's like 00:34:36.460 --> 00:34:38.620 you do have to remind yourself that 00:34:40.460 --> 00:34:46.140 I like how you said that customizing is not the skill and there's so many people who are just obsessed with the customization 00:34:46.140 --> 00:34:48.425 and then they're not actually 00:34:48.505 --> 00:34:50.505 doing anything. Right? Like so 00:34:50.825 --> 00:34:52.585 it's it's like, 00:34:53.065 --> 00:34:55.625 don't be an artist about it. Right? Like Mhmm. 00:34:57.945 --> 00:35:05.120 At the end of the day, you want something that's gonna add value to your own personal life, that's gonna add value to your business life. And 00:35:06.080 --> 00:35:07.680 and it's 00:35:07.680 --> 00:35:10.480 it's a rabbit hole basically and 00:35:11.040 --> 00:35:14.880 to to go down and where you're like optimizing and optimizing and optimizing, 00:35:15.040 --> 00:35:15.200 but 00:35:16.285 --> 00:35:17.245 don't do it. 00:35:17.565 --> 00:35:34.690 Yeah. This handles the optimization for you. Like, the biggest thing when people say like a lot of people have asked me like what's been the most useful thing about like Hermes agent. Like, day to day, I work at a fund and I'm able to talk to more founders and have better conversations with them because a lot of the background work is now handled by my personal agent. 00:35:35.330 --> 00:35:40.850 That's awesome. That's a huge win for me. If we can talk to 20% more companies or 30% more companies, 00:35:41.010 --> 00:35:48.315 we have better signal, we get better deal flow, we're helping out more founders, we're eventually gonna return more as a fund. Right? It just makes me better at my job. 00:35:49.035 --> 00:35:58.155 It's a big deal. Right? Like, you do that's the way I see it is like if you value your time at, say, dollars 500 an hour in terms of the opportunities that could come, 00:35:58.555 --> 00:36:00.555 that's a that's a huge that's a huge deal. So 00:36:02.240 --> 00:36:08.000 Imran, thank you so much for giving us, you know, the go to guide for installing Ermes agent, 00:36:08.240 --> 00:36:09.840 playing with Ermes agent, 00:36:10.160 --> 00:36:11.440 making skills, 00:36:11.520 --> 00:36:18.555 installing it with g stack and Obsidian. I really appreciate it. I'll include links for where you can follow Imran 00:36:19.035 --> 00:36:21.995 on the Internet, which is where I found him. And 00:36:22.315 --> 00:36:27.115 I I think that you're super talented at at explaining technical concepts 00:36:27.115 --> 00:36:30.235 in a really simple way. So I would love to have you back on the show. 00:36:31.310 --> 00:36:35.950 But people, let us let me know. Let me know in the comments, you know. Is this did did 00:36:36.350 --> 00:36:40.590 did you did you feel it? I think he he he brought this off. So thanks again, Imran. 00:36:40.990 --> 00:36:47.225 Is there anything you wanna leave people with? Yeah. I work at a fund. It's called Alif. Check us out alif.build, 00:36:47.225 --> 00:36:49.385 alif.build. 00:36:49.385 --> 00:36:51.705 And of course, I'm on social media at Imranye. 00:36:51.705 --> 00:36:54.265 I think after this, I'm just gonna make more videos. 00:36:55.225 --> 00:37:00.025 There you go. Let's do it. Yeah. Let's do it. Alright. Thanks a lot. Alright. Thanks for having me, man.